pep shocks...

[Tommy 17]

i am gonna be gettin shocks here in a month or 2 so i wanna start doin my h-w on them...

so far i am leadin towards elka but i wanna know about peps...

what is the differnce between limited mass and zps...

can i convert my rear shock like a elka....

how much is the front shocks and the rear conversion(if it can be done)...


thanks guyz............... TOMMY

[Dave400ex]

Here is some Info on the Limited Mass Fronts.
Adjustable Triple Rate Springs and Crossovers are used. The Mechanical Active Damping with external damping adjustment increases the ability to turn faster by allowing less chassis roll. It also allows more of a lift for jumps and an anti-bottoming control when landing. Price is $750.

Here is some on the ZPS Fronts.
The ZPS Fronts come with the Adjustable triple rate springs and crossovers, a unique multi sensing damping, the one-of-a-kind ride height adjustment, and adjustable remote gas reservoirs.

All of that is from ATV Connection.

The ZPS have a lot more Options.

Yes you can Rebuild your Stock Rear Shock. Baldwin has a Limited Mass Rear Rebuild for $289 and a ZPS Rear Rebuild for $425. He said they take 3-4 Weeks.

The Limited Mass Fronts and Rear Rebuild are $1039 and the ZPS Fronts and Rear Rebuild is $1320. There is a $281 Difference.

[Tommy 17]

thanks warrior man... i think that cleared it up for me...

[trx400ex]

What are you leaning towards now?

[Tommy 17]

i am still hooked on them elkas... for the price i don't think u can go wrong buyin the elkas... now just 200$ more and i can get them!!!!!

[NJ300ex]

What size shafts do the limited mass have?

[Dave400ex]

The Standard Race have a 1/2 Shaft which I think is like the Works. The Limited Mass and ZPS have 5/8 Shaft which I think is PEP`s own built one. Most people think they use Work`s Bodies but I think Gabe told me they have their own. You won`t go wrong with the Limited Mass or ZPS.

I have talked to Gabe and many others GNCC Racers that have the ZPS. I told them I didn`t want to Cheap out and Adams44 told me I am cheaping out by getting the Limited Mass. Now I think I want the ZPS. The only Problem with that is that they are $320 more then the Elka`s I was going to get and $281 more then the Limited Mass. I think I would rather Wait and get the Best. I do not want to go Cheap. Shocks are the most important part on a Quad. I want to get the right Shocks, and I think the PEP ZPS are it.

Anymore Questions?

[Foxrage]

Ya i got all that from baldwin. I think I want the limited mass but not sure either.

[Dave400ex]

Well the ZPS is by far the Best. Like it said in my First Post, the Limited Mass will not have near as many features as the ZPS. Plus the ZPS has many different adjustments that the Limited Mass don`t. I think I`ll save the Extra $281 for the ZPS.

I do have a lot more Info on PEP Shocks if you Guys want some more. I have 8 Pages.

[Tommy 17]

send me all 8 pages;)

[Dave400ex]

Ok I will get you those. I have to finish Language Homework. :mad:

[slates74]

AXIS BABY!!!!!!!!!

[Dave400ex]

HUGE MONEY BABY!

[honda400ex27]

speaking of shocks! i have a set of front PEP Limited mass shocks for sale.....they are setup for +2 arms, 175lb...these shocks are awesome.....$675 takes them

[EX 80]

400ex21.... get the elkas they are nice. If you got a few extra bucks go all out with the AXIS's.

[Foxrage]

hey Honda400ex27 i wish i had the money right now so i could buy your front end but i dont have the money as we speek im saving.:D

[honda400ex27]

how much longer til u can afford the shocks?

[Foxrage]

4 ever lol no a while probly im not out of school yet so i cant get a job.

[Dave400ex]

That is a Good Deal for those Limited Mass Shocks. You wouldn`t have to Wait.

[honda400ex27]

$675 is as awesome deal on these shocks...like i said they cost me a pretty penny....i need to sell these quickly...they are in great shape, like i said on been run 2 races, no practices....they come with some red shockcovers too...

[Dave400ex]

Here is some Info from ATV Connection

The Shocks of Champions!


The most rugged ATV shock you will ever see! Notice the triple rate springs. Different size bumps, or "hits" are soaked up by three different size springs.
All PEP shocks come with detailed explanation sheets allowing you to dial in your shocks for different terrain or racetracks. All of the PEP front shocks come with easy spring tuning triple rate springs and crossovers. The short spring on the top of the shock works about 10% of the wheel's travel and soaks up small bumps plus the acceleration of the quad. The medium sized spring in the middle of the shock works about 20-30% of the wheel's travel and acts in mid size bumps, braking bumps, and whoop-de-doos. The remaining percentage of the wheel's travel is absorbed by the large spring located on the bottom of the shock soaking up landings from big jumps.

PEP "Standard Race" Front and Rear Shocks:
These are PEP's entry-level performance shocks. They are designed for rec-riders, less aggressive dune riders, and "B" and "C" class racers. Making up about 10% of PEP's overall sales, don't confuse the name "Standard" as being equal to your stock shocks. These are PEP's lowest price shocks, but are far superior to stock shocks.

Fronts:
All Standard Race front shocks come with PEP's easy spring tuning triple rate springs and crossovers. The shocks offer low-maintenance and non-adjustable external damping. Internally they have competition proven bump sensitive damping that is tuned to work with the triple rate springs and crossovers for superior response to small, medium and large bumps. The top two springs have adjustable crossover rings for fine-tuning. Gas remote reservoirs are found for consistent damping and control. Preload is adjustable. They come preset and generally will not need to be adjusted. However they can be if so desired.
Retail price is $595 a pair.

Rear:
This shock can be applied to all link and no-link applications. It comes with a single adjustable spring, remote gas reservoir, adjustable multi-stage damping, adjustable preload, adjustable compression and rebound damping.
Retail price is $750

PEP "Limited Mass" Front and Rear Shocks:
The Limited Mass shocks, short for "Limited Mechanical Active Suspension System" account for about 40% of PEP shock sales and are designed for Pro and "A" level riders that demand the most from their suspension. This type of PEP shock has provided pro ATV racers with a championship winning suspension. To be more precise 3 SCORE ATV Championships, 3 Mickey Thompson Entertainment Group Championships, Over 30 Pro and A level AMA Grand National Championships, and countless local and regional championships throughout the world.

Fronts:
Adjustable triple rate springs and crossovers are used. The mechanical active damping with external damping adjustment increases the ability to turn faster by allowing less "chassis roll". It also allows more of a "lift" for jumps and an anti-bottoming control when landing.
Retail price is $750 a pair

Rear:
This rear shock is available for no-link applications, such as the ones found on Laeger and Lone Star frames. Offering the same qualities of the front LTD Mass shocks, they should be used with LTD Mass front shocks only. It features a dual spring with tunable crossovers allowing a firm to soft spring rate. Adjustable preload, compression and rebound damping are also found on this popular race shock.
Retail price is $795

PEP "ZPS" Front and Rear Shocks:

This is the tricked out quad that Mark Ehrhardt used to win the 1998 Pace Motorsports US Off-Road Championship. Mark's choice of shocks are the PEP Zero Preload System shocks. The same type of shocks won Tim Farr an AMA Grand National Championship!
Now into their third year of existence, ZPS (Zero Preload System) shocks are PEP's latest creation. Recommended for Pro and "A" level racing. Most recently the ZPS shocks were used to capture first and second place at the 12 hours of Pont De Vaux annual ATV race. These are the shocks that have bogged down all of the PEP distributors. They simply can't make them fast enough. Currently making up 50% of all sales,(and growing daily)-- these shocks are the best thing to enter the sport of ATV Racing since the fourth wheel. To take full advantage of this superior shock system, PEP recommends that ZPS shocks be used in conjunction with one another.
The reason for all the fuss is that these shocks allow the rider to adjust his ride height without sacrificing any wheel travel. For example an ATV with 12" of wheel travel could be set to sit at a ride height of an ATV with only 8" of wheel travel. What does this mean? With the variable center of gravity, cornering speeds can increase greatly. Another added bonus with a variable center of gravity is the ability to obtain more traction than a higher conventional sitting quad. Another way to explain this is that the chassis "floats" on the suspension, allowing for maximum weight transfer. Since the wheel travel remains the same, the shocks provide the same terrain gobbling smoothness, and big hit absorption as the LTD Mass Shocks. There are plenty of technical things that happen to allow for these extraordinary shocks to work the way they do, but we figured we could spare you all the complexities and let AMA Grand National Champion, Tim Farr, say what he thinks of the ZPS shocks:

"It's like riding my TT bike and my Motocrosser at the same time! I can go into a turn fast and hard without worrying about high siding. It's amazing that I can do this without compromising the quality of the shock's ability to soak up hard landings. With this combination I feel more in control with less fatigue, that results in going faster and winning." --Tim Farr

Front:
The ZPS fronts come with the adjustable triple rate springs and crossovers, a unique multi sensing damping, the one-of-a-kind ride height adjustment, and adjustable remote gas reservoirs.
Retail price is $895

Rear:
All rear ZPS shocks come with unique multi sensing damping and spring characteristics allowing a firm to soft spring rate. The one-of-a-kind ride height adjustment, adjustable remote gas reservoir, and external compression and rebound adjustment all add up to the premier shock for ATV racing. This shock is available for all link and no-link applications.
Retail Price is $895

[Dave400ex]

Now this is the Review from ATV Connection. After reading this I don`t see why anybody would want anything but PEP.

The Shocking Truth
PEP Shocks
Why All the Fuss?

No matter how you line 'em up, PEP shocks are the chosen favorite of 8 of every 10 Pro ATV racers worldwide!
With about 80% of the nation's top ATV pro racers using PEP shocks, we knew they had to be pretty good shocks. But why are they so special? What does Wayne Mooradian and Mark Baldwin of Performance Engineered Products do to these babies that make them the chosen favorites by so many professionals? For the answers to these questions we sat in with Wayne and Mark Baldwin, as they fabricated and rebuilt shocks. After observing them at work, we had the chance to bolt a new pair on our '88 250R and experience them for ourselves.
Performance Engineered Products was formed 16 years ago when Wayne Mooradian recognized the need for better "race-equipped" ATV suspensions. His background in motorsports is rather impressive. From the 1970's to early '80's, Wayne turned wrenches for over 30 factory motorcycle racers. Not many motorcycle mechanics can say they were the factory race team mechanic for the Maico, Can-Am, Suzuki, Husqvarna, and Yamaha motorcycle racing teams. Wayne was also part of the research and development team that propelled a dominating win-record for the most successful factory motorcycle racing team of the '80's - Team Honda! His credentials don't just exist in motorcycle racing. Wayne developed all of the suspension components for the 1985-86 factory Kawasaki three wheelers of Jimmy White. In '87-88 he developed the suspension products for the Team Suzuki Quad Racer's of Gary Denton, Rodney Gentry, Jeff Watts, and Jim Putnam. During the same season, Wayne built suspension systems for the Kawasaki Mojave's and Tecate 4's of the Team Green support riders of Jackie Meadows and Charlie Shepherd. In the late '80's he developed the motors, chassis, and suspension for the Honda desert ATV team. As you can see from Wayne's list of accomplishments, there's plenty of proven knowledge found in every PEP shock.
Four years ago, the overwhelming demand for his performance shocks became too great, and PEP Associates came to the rescue. The biggest is Nac's Racing and Baldwin Motorsports. Wayne has shared all of his shock-building knowledge with Mark Baldwin of Baldwin Motorsports. Now Baldwin is not only responsible for new shocks, but his facility is also the sole authorized service center for PEP shocks on the East Coast.
Now, both West and East Coasts have facilities to build and service the performance shocks. Even with the two facilities working full time, there is at least a 4-6 week wait for customers. That's just how great the demand is for PEP's custom shocks.

PEP Shock Service:
Both PEP's East and West Coast facilities offer complete shock service and revalving. Let's face it with all the abuse an ATV shock goes through, it's just a matter of time before it needs servicing. (Changing the oil in a shock is not servicing the shock.) When you send a shock into a PEP authorized service center you get more than the oil changed. The service includes disassembling the shafts, valving, pistons, reservoirs, hoses, and bladders.
After everything is disassembled, the shims are checked for splits. The piston faces are looked over for pits (this results in a lack of damping). All the clicking mechanisms are checked on the compression and rebound knobs and the shafts are checked for pitting. Metering rods are checked for even the slightest tolerance of being worn or bent. Anything found damaged is replaced, adjusters are inspected, cleaned and greased. In the last step, seals and bushings are replaced and the final inspections and assembly are completed. This detailed commitment goes into every shock that is sent in for service. The result is a shock that comes back to you just as it was when you first got it. In fact you probably won't recognize your old shock when it comes back to you! PEP will revalve and service any shock. So before you label your stock shocks as completely shot give PEP a call. Prices for shock service and modification depend on what is found when they take the shock apart. Basic prices are as follows:

Revalving $150- $175 per shock
Springs (if needed) $90- $110 per shock
General service of $85 for a pair of fronts and $75 for a rear.

How'd we like them?

This is the pile of material that made up our PEP front shocks.
We had abused ourselves and our Honda Fourtrax long enough, it was time for some real suspension. We took the advice of Wayne Mooradian to get our shocks from his east-coast distributor and right hand man, Mark Baldwin. With all the answers supplied to Mark Baldwin's questions, he suggested a pair of Limited Mass shocks for the front, and a shock modification service to our stock rear shock.
For an accurate evaluation of the PEP shocks, our idea was to test them on a track with as many suspension-jarring obstacles as possible. The terrain consisted of two huge whoop sections at 100 yards each, a double jump, two small single jumps and one monstrous jump. With two test riders and a stopwatch, we were ready for some serious ground-pounding.
Our test riders rode as fast as they possibly could for ten laps each using the stock front shocks and the new re-worked rear shock. Our riders noticed the beefier rear shock worked better than a stock one, but couldn't get a good feel for the rear since the wimpy front shocks were working so poorly. Out of the ten laps, each rider's best times were taken from their third lap, which was 2:43 and 2:48. An interesting note here was that lap times near the end of the 10 lap sessions consistently got worse. Since the course consisted of mostly whoops, the suspension was constantly being worked. The oil in the stock front shocks would get hot and thin to a lower viscosity, resulting in a "pogo-stick" effect on the quads front end.
Now came the fun part. No other changes would take place except for bolting on the new PEP Limited Mass front shocks. After fighting to decide who would ride first, we were ready to see what kind of difference the PEP shocks would make.
Lap times would tell the whole story. Both riders put over ten laps in with their best times of 2:31 and 2:33! That's a total of 12 and 15 seconds faster from their best times with the front stockers. Judging from the data we collected in our day of testing, we calculated that the new PEP shocks were able to cut an average of 9.8 seconds off of each lap!
The test riders said that they were able to shift to a higher gear in the long demanding whoop sections. The front of the quad swallowed up every whoop like it was only half the size that it really was. And as for landing from the big air jump on the course, nearly every landing with the stock fronts resulted in an extreme bottoming out--near crash experience. With the PEP front shocks, not once did the suspension bottom out! Most notable about the PEP shocks was that the shocks barely even got warm to the touch, while the stockers could barely be touched from severe heat build up.
The price for our new PEP suspension wasn't cheap. Simply put, you get what you pay for. Yes PEP shocks are expensive, but we strongly feel that they're well worth the money. Our overall recommendation is to ride a 4-wheeler that has PEP shocks. This article simply can't describe what a "hands-on" experience can. Even though your size and weight will probably be different than the rider whose quad you will be trying, you will get a good idea of just how awesome these shocks really are.

PEP - West Coast (909) 590-4111
PEP - East Coast (440) 224-2734

Here is some Info on Compression, Rebound and Preload.

Confusing Shock Terms Made Easy

Before confusing you with all kinds of fancy shock jargon, we'll clue you in on how a shock works and more importantly how to adjust them correctly. There are plenty of variables that can drastically change the performance of your shocks. We suggest you try only one variable at a time. Experiment and dial your shocks in for your type of riding and the type of terrain you ride in. It might be a good idea to print this article and keep it with your tools. This way you'll have it handy the next time you fiddle with your shocks.

Preload
This identifies how stiff the spring is on the shock. At the top of the shock there are two nuts. The one at the bottom is the adjustment nut, while the one at the top is the jam-nut; it locks the adjustment nut in place. Tightening the adjustment nut will increase the preload, allowing for a stiffer ride. To provide a softer ride, back-off the adjustment nut up on the shock, thereby decreasing preload.

Compression Damping
Compression damping is the amount of force the shock will absorb. A harder compression setting should be used to soak up landings from massive jumps, while softer compression should be used while riding over less aggressive terrain. To adjust the compression on the gas remote reservoirs just turn the screw to the softer or harder position. In the event there is no indicator, unscrewing the dial will allow a softer compression, while screwing the dial in will make for a harder compression setting.

Rebound
The speed that the shock returns to its original position is how fast it rebounds. For a riding area with lots of jumps or whoops in a row, a faster rebound should be used. A smooth riding area such as a TT track will allow the opposite. To adjust the rebound, look for an adjuster near the bottom of the shock. To adjust for a faster rebound simply unscrew the adjuster, to allow for a slower rebound, screw it in.

[Tommy 17]

i want peps but i think i am gonna end up with the elka... i dunno yet...

[Dave400ex]

Did you Read all of that? I have read that many Times. I think I will Save the Extra $300 for the ZPS. I`ve heard to many Good Things not to.

[Foxrage]

I know those PEPs are awsome but Elkas will be up there. Im not sure what ill get yet if i keep my 400ex ill get PEPs If i get my friends C-dale ill probly get Elkas.

[Dave400ex]

You are looking at a C-Dale now? I would be Careful. I have heard those things over heat really easy. The Nac`s Team has had that Problem.

[86atc250r]

Tell the whole story now... Overheating due to mud packed radiators doesn't qualify as being "easy to overheat" to me... Any liquid cooled quad will overheat if it's radiator is packed with mud.

There's already far too much bad info being passed on the forums, don't really need any more...

I've personally abused mine in the dunes and never even heard the cooling fan kick on. When doing a slow trail ride the fan will cycle - just as it should.

However, it's hard to beat air cooling in some conditions - hard to overheat on a muddy day at the races when you don't have a radiator to clog - I've finished a lot of races on my 400EX where the liquid cooled Banshee's and Raptors had trouble.

[Dave400ex]

Well I wasn`t trying to put down Cannondale. I was just saying that Nac`s had some Problems at Red Bud. I`m sure it was the Mud. I would Ride a C-Dale without even thinking about my 400.

[86atc250r]

BTW Warriorman, I've got my PEP ZPS shocks now.

I've got one race on them now & they're working great. I've got to do some fine tuning and get some more time on them, but so far I really like them.

I haven't jumped them yet, but they take up the terrain well, keep the quad under control, and are very well balanced.

[Dave400ex]

Yeah after talking with you and Adams44, I think I want PEP ZPS. I was looking at the Limited Mass, but Adams44 said the Ride Height would help a lot. He told me to just Save fpr the Best. I think I`m going to do that. I`ll Order the Fronts when I almost have all the Money and then Wait to Order the Rear Rebuild. What did your Shocks Cost in the End?

[86atc250r]

About $1300 if I remember correctly....

[Dave400ex]

Well that sounds Right. The Fronts are $895 and the Rear Rebuild is $425 so that would be $1320 Total. I`m about Half Way for the Fronts.

I ride the two different setup and i realy recomend you to go whit the elka. The pep does great gob on jumping, like the elka, but you'll see the big difference on small and big woups. Riding the elka is like flying over the terrain. The elka valving is so great on big jump you realy get in confience with them. They also get great adjusment rigth for your need. The pep tech. is a bit outdated, elka tech. came from many specialitis like f1 and roadracing. Dont be afraid to go with them. The expention is now finish (they were growing bigger) they will ship you the stuf very fast. The quality of the product is top of the line. I knew a lot of rider that use elka and no one got problem with them and guy like the way they feel. And man look at these piggyback they look so good. The ball is now on your side,so you'll have to make a decision, dont wait the price is suppose to rise.

Sam