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View Full Version : 12 Hours of ATV America - MOVED to Rausch Creek MX Park



Admin
02-23-2005, 09:07 AM
Its Official,

The 12 Hours of ATV America new location for 2005 will be at Rausch Creek MX Park in Tremont, PA.

I am sure this decision will come some controversy because of its Eastern Location and not central location in the Country, but after looking at the majority of the entries, they are mostly from the Eastern United States and I expect to see the event filled to capacity this year.

Also, the crew at Rausch Creek is dedicated to making the 12 Hours of ATV America the Premier ATV event, and they will do what ever it takes to make it bigger and better. For those attending the 6 Hour event over the summer, they will get a glimpse of what is to come for the 12 Hour event.

John Pellan will be announcing the news shortly on ********.com with more details about the change.

Johnny & Monica
02-23-2005, 09:51 AM
This SUX !!!!!!!!!

Shawn H
02-23-2005, 10:42 AM
Its already posted :mad:

Admin
02-23-2005, 11:21 AM
Quote from ********.com


"Fast-Trak Promo (parent company of ATV Scene.com) today announced the Rausch Creek facility in Valley View, PA as the new location for its annual Maxxis 12 Hours of ATV America event held October 29, 2005. Rausch Creek will also host round five of the Maxxis 6 Hours of ATV America franchise on July 16 of this year.

”The decision to move the event from its Iowa birthplace was not an easy one“, said John Pellan of Fast-Trak Promo/ATV Scene.com. “The Iowa based group of Bryan Shipley, Bruce Breeser, Bob Fleege and Jim Dahl were instrumental in building the now World famous 12 Hours of ATV America name. The event's roots will always be in the All-American city of Fort Dodge, IA. I’ll always appreciate and remember the hard work and dedication from the above people (and several others also involved).” Pellan continues, “To be short, even though a thousand acre state funded OHV ride park is in the works in Fort Dodge, I felt that we just didn’t have a proper facility for the 2005 event.”

Two separate 6 mile courses are being constructed for the 6 and the 12 hour events at Rausch Creek. In consideration of allowing teams to prepare for the 12 hour event, the July 16th “6 Hours of PA”, will remain as the only night event of the six event series. Each race track at Rausch Creek will feature motocross, cross country and TT-style terrain. A new lit TT and oval track will be added this summer. In addition, Rausch Creek crews have already broken ground on what will soon be known as the largest and most professional pit parking in ATV racing.

”Ideally, I wanted the event somewhere in the middle of America so traveling from all points of the country would be some what realistic for teams and spectators wanting to participate. There were several reasons as to why Rausch Creek was selected even though it’s definitely not centrally located. Rather than list all the reasons, I’ll keep it simple by saying the entire Rausch Creek staff wanted this event more than any of the other places we’ve considered. There is, without a doubt, pure passion and a lot of heart at Rausch Creek. They have also raced the event all three years and know what they’re in for first hand”, said Pellan.

"John Pellan's Maxxis 12 Hours of ATV America race has quickly become one of the premiere racing events for our sport and it is a great honor for Rausch Creek to be a part of it.", said Rausch Creek general manager, Mike McDonald. "Rausch Creek is proud to be named as the location of the 2005 12 Hours of ATV America, and we are committed to do what ever it takes to help realize John’s dreams of making this the number one ATV event in the world. We plan on pushing the limits in any way we can in order to help make this the best ATV race - bar none!”

The 2005 Maxxis 12 Hours of ATV America event is expected to attract as many as 150 teams from all over the country and beyond. To enter you must pre enter at 12hoursofatvamerica.com when online registration opens later this year in August.

For more information on the Maxxis 12 Hours of ATV America check out: 12hoursofatvamerica.com or read past event info from the ATV Scene race archives found here.

jlhughes750
02-23-2005, 11:40 AM
this is great news!!!!!!!! I'm sayin the attendance will exceed 150 teams!!!!!

79400ex
02-23-2005, 11:45 AM
THisshow that the east coast riders rule the atv off road racing. The aeast coastridrs will not fill the fill field because they won't want to spend the money or the the time it will take for it. THis is also shown by hta they won't come to the midwest to race. How many east coast was at the 6 hjour texas race? not many. More texas and midwest teams then them. THe riders in the midwest have and will always spendf the tim e and the money do this. Even on short notice.

Shawn H
02-23-2005, 11:51 AM
Its all about the Money All the stuff above is pointless it boils down to Money IMO!!!!

I have to agree Ft Dodge does not have the capabilties as Rausch. There had to be to other sites within reason to choose from centrally located but were not considered due to not bringing in enough revenue Im sure>

Admin
02-23-2005, 11:56 AM
Just for the record, There were 49 teams that signed up for the Texas 6 Hour and 31 of them were from Texas with 9 from the neighboring states OK and AR for a total of 40 local teams.

Only 9 teams actually made the trip from none bordering states which is less than 20%, so I wouldn't jump on the MidWest riders willing to travel bandwagon.

There were only 6 teams from MO and IA that made the trip, which wasn't many and it wasn't that far away.

The numbers speak for themselves.

Shawn H
02-23-2005, 12:09 PM
Whats the numbers for the 12hrs Harlen?

Thats not the same as the 12hrs and with the GNCC the day before alot of people didnt want to trash there Quad for 8 hrs of racing with out going thru it after the GNCC. Im sure the rain had something to do with it as well.

joedirt
02-23-2005, 01:17 PM
Dude all you midwest guys need to stop. All us east coast boys went out there and why don't you come out here for one race. I travel all year long to different races do you hear me *****en. The race was in your back yard for 3yrs and you guys didn't fill the field watch what Rausch does. Classes will be full. Pellan is a good guy and I don't think he wants to make a killin off the race. Remember in order to pay the purse you must draw the field. By the way I know a bunch of teams from the east coast that made the drive out to Iowa.

cdalejef
02-23-2005, 01:29 PM
Its the exact same distance for me to travel to either location but I think the Raush track has much more to offer than what was in Iowa.

jlhughes750
02-23-2005, 01:48 PM
We wanted to race the 12 hour bad and were willing to do it no matter what!!! Our mech. Chuck Godshall had to pack up the trailer and quad while we were getting changed after racing 12 hours so he could make the 24 hour drive home to go straight to work!!!!!!! Were in Philly area Pa. We would head west as far as we need to race an event like this!!!!!I 'm just so relieved we don't have to do it this year!!!! I do however hope that we get the riders from the west that are as dedicated as us to come out here!!! Team Powerline will be back at Rausch, no more team Amy!!!;)

later,J

QUADROOKIE
02-23-2005, 06:32 PM
I say they come up with 3 tracks---Pa. --- Ia. --- and maybe one in Az. or southeren Ca. then just rotate the location. That would be as fair as anything. I wanted to race in Ft. Dodge this year, but if its gotta go, then I guess Its gotta go. Maybe us mo. and Ia. people can organize our own NEW and IMPROVED version of the 12 hour!!!!!:D

700 racer
02-23-2005, 07:04 PM
this will be a never ending debate but i know i have made all 3 iowa races and would have been back this yr.
i am glad it is in pa though and know that there will be a better turn out. i bet it is maxed out this year. i raced the ga and pa 6 hr last year and will again this yr but pa was an awesome event without a hitch. i cant wait.

harlen wanna race this yr?

Admin
02-23-2005, 07:58 PM
Originally posted by 700 racer
Harlen wanna race this yr?

Sure, I would love to race both the 6 Hour and 12 Hour Event this year if a team is willing to have me. It would have to be either a Vet, Industry, A, or Pro Team. I think I would kill myself on a Utility quad :)

Shawn H
02-23-2005, 08:16 PM
Originally posted by joedirt
Dude all you midwest guys need to stop. All us east coast boys went out there and why don't you come out here for one race. I travel all year long to different races do you hear me *****en. The race was in your back yard for 3yrs and you guys didn't fill the field watch what Rausch does. Classes will be full. Pellan is a good guy and I don't think he wants to make a killin off the race. Remember in order to pay the purse you must draw the field. By the way I know a bunch of teams from the east coast that made the drive out to Iowa.

You got 13 GNCC races I dont know what your talking about:confused:

I agree that Rausch would be a better location, I dont agree with it being so far. It should stay centrally located!!

Johnson
02-23-2005, 08:39 PM
I won't race it again.

Prairiewrench
02-23-2005, 09:16 PM
Looks like there may just end up being two 12 hour races with different names! LOL!! Maybe an east coast west coast thing! The wheels are already turning and the ball is rolling! There will be a meeting this weekend and after that we may post a tid bit or two of info!
Just so you all know, my team and I are not against running to PA to race the 12 hour, just don't want to if we don't have to! :D

The rewards for winning are not great enuf for the amount of money put out to go that far to race! We took second in the Texas 6hr and got plauqes,, there were NO contingency prizes! But in the end it will not be up to me,, I will leave it up to the guys that make up the team,,, the riders,,, as to what they want to do!

rpmquad
02-23-2005, 09:47 PM
if we get anouther race in ia... certified racing will be more then happy to donate a prize or two lol....very sad to see it leave....there was alot of pride having that event in ia....

Johnny & Monica
02-23-2005, 09:52 PM
I agree Ron I`ll do my best to help out an get somethings from sponsors an what not to help out.But worse comes to worse an nothing coming in Iowa we`ll travel to beat the raush creek team again on there turf this time lol JOKING RAUSH CREEK:devil:

Johnny & Monica
02-23-2005, 10:39 PM
THIS IS QUOTED FROM ATV SCENE 2002
Location

Since Fort Dodge, IA is in the middle of the country, we're able to pull teams from California to Conneticut. A track built in PA or Arizona would surely limit attendance from the other half of the country. In addition, the track is only a few miles from the city of Fort Dodge. In fact, it's only two miles from the Holiday Inn and as close as five miles from ten other hotels.


Facility

The Mid West Offroad Racing complex features excellent elevation changes that make it perfect for spectating.. The rolling landscape begged for a premier ATV course. The facility has a huge amount of potential. It will grow as the event grows. In addition the local ATV club, The Webster County Wheelers, the City of Fort Dodge, Webster County and the State of Iowa are working together to build a premier ATV Park. There is a good chance the neighboring land will become a state backed recreational ATV park. This means more land and bigger and better attractions in the future. Although the proposed park would be located across the river it would provide another location for various activates as the 12-Hours of ATV America grows into a festive multi-day end of the year extravaganza.


People

The icing on the cake as to where to hold the 12 Hours of ATV America - the fine peple of Fort Dodge themselves! The help and support we get from the people of Fort Dodge is outstanding! From the Messanger Newspaper to the radio stations right down to the city officals and the mayor - this place deserves to hold the reigns of the future home of the World's premier ATV event! We were amazed at just how bad the city wanted an event like this - something not too regular in ATV racing. We'll be back for sure

jb500ex
02-24-2005, 05:25 AM
i for one am very happy about this, this is the only race within 4 hours of my house, other then district races

Johnny & Monica
02-24-2005, 07:33 AM
Well all the gncc`s are over 10 hours from us:( but we still try to hit atleast 3 a year would be nicw to do them all someday But fort dodge was only 4 hours from here .I`m sure if Fort Dodge don`t do something this year we`ll be at raush creek in oct.
But yesterdays news had me so mad I was ready to return John Pellans transponders to a place they would hurt an not work.It was a big shock I slept on it an got over it:D We`ll be in Ia. 1st choice an if it dont happen I guess we`ll make the long haul to Rausch creek
Please don`t move Ironman to Utah lol Cant take the stress:D

Derno24
02-24-2005, 08:48 AM
Guys I understand your dilema here completely, but you really should think about what you are saying. It is coming off that the race was good because it was in my back yard, but if they move it screw em. I understand your mad, but you should be mad at the promoter not the move. I drove out to Iowa and Back last year and was planning to do it again this year. I have no problem driving as it seems this is the only way to go to race. I complain about it, but I still do it.

I just think you guys are taking your fight with the promoter out on people who are on the east coast.

Derno24
02-24-2005, 08:50 AM
Originally posted by Admin
Sure, I would love to race both the 6 Hour and 12 Hour Event this year if a team is willing to have me. It would have to be either a Vet, Industry, A, or Pro Team. I think I would kill myself on a Utility quad :)

I thought you weren't going to do the 12 hr this year?


Just messing with ya Harlen!:blah:

besides when are ya calling me back?

ex kid
02-24-2005, 08:53 AM
Originally posted by Derno24
I thought you weren't going to do the 12 hr this year?


Just messing with ya Harlen!:blah:

besides when are ya calling me back?

Ron, need a partner/team? i do for the 6 and 12! i don't think the el blasturd would make it:chinese:

Silverfox@C&DRacing
02-24-2005, 09:11 AM
Originally posted by Prairiewrench
Looks like there may just end up being two 12 hour races with different names! LOL!! Maybe an east coast west coast thing! The wheels are already turning and the ball is rolling! There will be a meeting this weekend and after that we may post a tid bit or two of info!
Just so you all know, my team and I are not against running to PA to race the 12 hour, just don't want to if we don't have to! :D

The rewards for winning are not great enuf for the amount of money put out to go that far to race! We took second in the Texas 6hr and got plauqes,, there were NO contingency prizes! But in the end it will not be up to me,, I will leave it up to the guys that make up the team,,, the riders,,, as to what they want to do!

I agree the the rewards fo winning are not great enuf for the amount of money spent, gate fee is high, entry fee is high, and we got a plaque half the size for 1st place this year as we did for 2nd place last year :ermm:

I know it costs a lot of money to put these races on, but I feel the Iowa series does well because they reward the racers for showing up.

joedirt
02-24-2005, 11:02 AM
Snowgasm you want it in a central location! you want it in your backyard! Get over it you might have to travel ONE year if you want to race it. Look at the Eastcoast guys they do alot of the stadium races, race two GNCs that are far away. The GNCC keep on moving farther and farther away from there home base. If your this up tight about it talk to Pellan. Cause this year it looks like you might have to travel to race it

02-24-2005, 01:48 PM
I am not racing another race unless it's within 30 minutes of my house!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Silverfox@C&DRacing
02-24-2005, 01:57 PM
Originally posted by GNCCer
I am not racing another race unless it's within 30 minutes of my house!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am pretty sure that is not what they are getting at :rolleyes: If anyone on the west coast or Midwest want to race a GNCC the drive to them is anywhere between 10-28 hrs. so for us in the midwest we are lucky to hit 2 or 3 of the GNCC and I am sure not many on the west coast even attend. So for the 12hr to be in a central location was a smart decision. Everyone had the oportunity to participate. I am not knocking the Rausch facility (its a great place) but the east coast guys already have a national series.

79400ex
02-24-2005, 02:01 PM
joedirt, We here in the midwest travel to the east coast all the time to ride in GNCC and GNC races. What does it hurt for the east riders to come to the midwest once in alwhile, You guies complained if you have to travel more even a few hours to race. We here in the midwest have travel 10 to 20 hours to go to an East coast Gnnc. A lot of racers do this aleast once or twice a month.

joedirt
02-24-2005, 02:20 PM
I'm not the one complaining. I don't mind traveling, that's part of racing. If they have it in Iowa or in Pa I'll still be there. I prefer Rausch it's closer to home. You gus are all POed about losing it. The facts are Pellan doesn't want to chance it and hope the ATV park opens on time. He knows he has a great place in Rausch and they want the 12hrs. there. You can't blame anyone. Bottom line is if you want to race this years 12hrs. you are going to have to drive to Rausch.

jlhughes750
02-24-2005, 02:21 PM
Then find yourself a decent promoter in he west that will give u some decent events!!!!!!!! We had an awsome promoter in the east that built the best offroad series in the world....now there spreading it out so the rest of the country can participate!!!! Guess what the 12 hour is on the east coast this year, get over it, maybe next year it'll be in CA........:rolleyes:

79400ex
02-24-2005, 02:45 PM
joedirt, did you travel to the first gncc in texas? Give us reason. I went to the the first gncc and 6 hr in teaxs. It was over 1400 miles around tripped for me. I also did this bymyself. So don't say we won't travel to a race.

Kilabanshee
02-24-2005, 03:05 PM
I might be at this race depend on If I can get a group of riders together. My friend Mike flemming as you may know him hughes from the D6 B-class just bought borich's old yfz which most likely I'de be racing with him. Hope to see everyone there!
Later,
Brent

joedirt
02-24-2005, 03:38 PM
Texas was 1400 miles ONE WAY for us, 2800 miles round trip.

02-24-2005, 04:13 PM
Originally posted by Silverfox@C&DRacing
I am pretty sure that is not what they are getting at :rolleyes: If anyone on the west coast or Midwest want to race a GNCC the drive to them is anywhere between 10-28 hrs. so for us in the midwest we are lucky to hit 2 or 3 of the GNCC and I am sure not many on the west coast even attend. So for the 12hr to be in a central location was a smart decision. Everyone had the oportunity to participate. I am not knocking the Rausch facility (its a great place) but the east coast guys already have a national series.

I was just joking around I don't care where it is at. But here is one thing. you mentioned being centrally located was a smart decision. I say it SEEMS like it should be a smart decision. most of the people at the race were East coat people anyway. If 1/4 of the people at the event would have been west coast 1/4 east coast and 1/3 central (which is what would make sense) then Yes centrally located woule be PERFECT. But reallaty is that no west coast people came and the central located people were few for the event being in THEIR area. I am sure this event was not created Too cater to the centrally located people it was created hopeing to draw the largest crowd possible. your statement about "but the east coast guys already have a national series" That's a good point! a promotor should have a race just for you guys. half the size of what he could have. no publisty, no profit. Yep just for the central people who don't have a national series. yeah i pitty you!

rowlrag
02-24-2005, 04:26 PM
All us racers buy a small island in the carribean and race all over it, won't have to drive anywhere.

crayfz
02-24-2005, 05:00 PM
Originally posted by rowlrag
All us racers buy a small island in the carribean and race all over it, won't have to drive anywhere.

I'm in.

atvrulz
02-24-2005, 05:02 PM
This sucks! The highlight of my year last year, was driving down to Fort Dodge to watch the pro's in person, who otherwise we only see in videos and in magazines.

Johnny & Monica
02-24-2005, 07:42 PM
It's not just the drive that I'm complaining about it's really a matter of principle. Read this forum and you'll see why there's alot more to the story than sitting in a vehicle for 15 or 20 hours.

http://********.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=10422&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

79400ex
02-24-2005, 09:38 PM
Joedirt. I aplogize to you for say that you don,t travel. However, I traveled out of midwest to 7 national last year by myself it was very expesize to do the national on the east caost. And you complain about traveling to 2 gnc and 1 gncc that not on the east. All we want for soome of the east coast rider to come to the midwest to race.
That all I have to say on this subject .

QUADROOKIE
02-24-2005, 10:04 PM
I kinda like the idea of having 3 12 hour events,one on each coast, and a midwest, and a season ending "12 hours national chamopionship" for the top 10 teams per class from the 3 local 12 hours races to compete on a rotation location. BUT, after reading the posts on ********, I dont think I would want this Pellan jackazz to be involved with any of it after the way he is acting like a spoiled little kid.

Johnny & Monica
02-24-2005, 10:06 PM
Originally posted by joedirt
Snowgasm you want it in a central location! you want it in your backyard! Get over it you might have to travel ONE year if you want to race it. Look at the Eastcoast guys they do alot of the stadium races, race two GNCs that are far away. The GNCC keep on moving farther and farther away from there home base. If your this up tight about it talk to Pellan. Cause this year it looks like you might have to travel to race it


Hey my buddy Snowgasm is gone for the weekend AN NOT HERE TO DEFEND HIMSELF.But I`ll put money on him coming to raush creek an kicking your ars all in good fun of course:devil: Lets all get over it an get back to racing:D We aint voting for a president ya know. The only time the gncc ever moved west is to Texas there always on the east side of the mississippi river.

rowlrag
02-24-2005, 10:11 PM
I'll bet money that the GNCC won't be back to Texas either, for the same reason there not going to Rausch again.

79400ex
02-24-2005, 10:12 PM
Way to johnny

Johnny & Monica
02-24-2005, 10:32 PM
Well Mike it`s getting carried away everyones mad at everyone An Harlen try`s his damndest to make this a awesome 1# site an everyone is arguing over something that aint going to get changed.So we need to move on an talk about racing an how much better things are getting The hell with it we`ll have to travel to raush creek I guess:( BUTTTTT someone there is buying my family dinner ( John Pellan?):D

79400ex
02-24-2005, 10:37 PM
Yes it over johnny . we all just have to move on.

QUADROOKIE
02-24-2005, 10:46 PM
Heyyyyyy How bout that IATVHSS???:D Race commin up in a few short weeks!!!!

Johnny & Monica
02-24-2005, 10:53 PM
Originally posted by QUADROOKIE
Heyyyyyy How bout that IATVHSS???:D Race commin up in a few short weeks!!!!


44 days 21 hours an 17 min. to be exact:D

QUADROOKIE
02-24-2005, 11:09 PM
Originally posted by Johnny & Monica
44 days 21 hours an 17 min. to be exact:D

I like how you think!!!:devil:

Prairiewrench
02-25-2005, 06:49 AM
IOWA's very own,, MIDWEST HARESCRAMBLE NATIONALS!!! :D :D :D Brought to you by the best darn Promoter on earth Andy Kyner,,, Iowa ATV Harescramble Series!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!:D :D

Prairiewrench
02-25-2005, 06:53 AM
I can hear it already!!!!! "" HANDS ON YOUR HELMETS""""":D

jlhughes750
02-25-2005, 07:07 AM
in case it got lost in all the BS........I am happy to see this years 12 Hour closer to home for us...it does however stink that its farther for you guys and gals, and I am sorry for that.... but I am still happy its at Rausch this year.......I had alot of fun in Iowa last year the track was awsome...........we had a team mate break a leg on his first lap and finished with 2 guys but Iowa was great!!!.........................I still think its great to have it at Rausch THIS YEAR.......Maybe it'll be back in its state of origin soon........but it is the 12 hours of AMERICA ..... not Iowa....so maybe everyone will get their turn....... this sports got alot of year left!!!!!!!!! lets all be positive.......Thanks John Pellan for helping out the sport!!;)

Johnny & Monica
02-25-2005, 07:35 AM
JLHUGHES750 We also had a blast at the 12 hour an won are class An I love the 12 hour stuff an getting over the po`ed feeling we`ll be at raush creek this oct. an hopfully july 16th if there going to move it around they may as well move the date to memoral or labor day weekends where us the working man can travel more without missing work an my kids missing school.Just my 2 cents more that dont equal a dollar:D

Harvey
02-27-2005, 11:36 PM
what about all the quad racers on the west coast that want to race the nationals? I don't think I hear them whining about driving 3000 miles every week-end. If you don't like the move, act on it and have your own darn race. We'll come! There are plenty of riders in the midwest, right?!

Shawn H
02-28-2005, 09:52 AM
Johnny thanks for defending me while I was traveling to Nevada.LOL

I'm over it.
I might make it to Rausch might not it will be a lasy minute desicion(sp).

I have driven to my fair share of races too!!


IDK either way at least we have a 6hr race in Wi and I hope a lot of you "East coasters" make it so my team can whoop the chit out of ya.:o

Kilabanshee
02-28-2005, 10:09 AM
Anyone short a person on their team? I'm looking for someone to group up with.

Johnny & Monica
02-28-2005, 10:14 AM
Originally posted by snowgasm
Johnny thanks for defending me while I was traveling to Nevada.LOL

I'm over it.
I might make it to Rausch might not it will be a lasy minute desicion(sp).

I have driven to my fair share of races too!!


IDK either way at least we have a 6hr race in Wi and I hope a lot of you "East coasters" make it so my team can whoop the chit out of ya.:o


Hell ya :devil: Everyones over it now thats get to mapping out raush creek an go have some fun.Turn this into a postive event an have some fun :D

catch22blaster
02-28-2005, 10:24 AM
this is awesome it went from driving 11 hours to only driving 2 or 3 hours to race 12 hours of america :) ;)

jlhughes750
03-10-2005, 12:41 PM
anynews on the new TT track they are building?

400exmom
03-10-2005, 05:07 PM
i just got asked to do it again with my team in 30+ ..i cant wait!!

on another note can anyone help me come up with a team name for 2 guys and a girl?? i caught WAY to much crap for riding with a team named The 3 Horsemen :o

bigjbull
03-11-2005, 07:28 AM
how about, "team 2 guys a girl and a quad"?

burrows
03-11-2005, 10:42 PM
Originally posted by bigjbull
how about, "team 2 guys a girl and a quad"?

Nah to long. Kim let me think on this one. This one is hard. The Wild Bunch, The Hims and Her, Nah not that one. The wild horseys. wow this is a hard one. Let me get with the guys and see what we can come up with......mommab

400exmom
03-11-2005, 11:12 PM
whatever you say ma!

how bout busted knuckles~ its after 12 am i just got done changing my starter motor (that pipe was a ****** to get off) every knuckle is scraped or bleeding~wrenching is for boys!!!

think bout it mom and let me know got plenty of time~* :)