Standard or Long Travel

[DUNEZRUNNER]

I am trying to decide on what type of a-arms I want to get. I ride off-road in the desert and in the dunes, would Long Travel a-arms be worth the extra price. I am planning on getting the elka dune shocks but just cant decide how much travel I will need. I am not a pro rider but I do like to jump and the stock suspension is bottoming out, any info would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks Thomas

[Big - D Racing]

long travel worth every penny. Ride a bike with aftermarket std. travel arms with good shocks say elka you'll think it's real nice. Then ride a long travel also with nice shocks and you'll be thinking the aftermarket std. travel sucked compared to the long.

[TORO1968]

Originally posted by DUNEZRUNNER
I am trying to decide on what type of a-arms I want to get. I ride off-road in the desert and in the dunes, would Long Travel a-arms be worth the extra price. I am planning on getting the elka dune shocks but just cant decide how much travel I will need. I am not a pro rider but I do like to jump and the stock suspension is bottoming out, any info would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks Thomas

I am in the exact same boat... :)

Any other opinions???

[fasterz]

the main advantages with LT isnt just the more travel, it is a bigger shock body so it can be set up and dialed in better. it also holds more fluids. as for the difference when riding, the dampening just seems so much smoother, ive rode both std nd lt with aftermarket shocks and the lt just blows it away and its not even much more money, im running the JRD front end with axis, with nothing but positive remarks, i will ony buy stuff from JRD for this reason, every thing is wonderful and it makes your happy your spending your money on something you know is going to impress you their site is www.jrd-mech.com

[TBD]

Just to clear things up, long travel should be called long shock. You can get the same amount of wheel travel out of both. More fluid doesn't mean the shock will run cooler. Because the shaft velocity is greater that means more energy needs to be displaced meaning more heat. You could tune a standard shock to work just as good. Standard or long shock, it doesn't matter. A-arm manufactures would like you to think it's a huge difference just so you'll spend the extra money. Bieng a suspension builder myself I do know that there is a little additional cost but that is due to different styles of shock mounts. It, in my opinion, isn't the amount that most arm manufactures up there prices.

[stocktires]

The only true "long travel" set-up is a laeger t-pin.

I'm in the same situation as you. I'll probably be going with long travel

[DUNEZRUNNER]

Thanks for all of the replys, I can see how a longer shock would be beneficial. Now what about triple rate and quad rate shocks Is that extra spring worth it?

Thanks
Thomas

[beak7707]

You ought to do a search on this, it has been covered a couple times. In the other post some very smart suspension people, proved LT isnt all its hopped up to be. Sure if money isnt an issue go for it, but if money is tight I dont think it would be worth it. Also if you are going with Elka shocks, I'm pretty sure all Lt elka's come with quad springs.

[DUNEZRUNNER]

So by it being a Long shock setup and not long travel does that mean that the wheel travel is not increased over the standard extended a-arms, and only the length of the shock is increased?

Thomas

[JDiablo]

Originally posted by stocktires
The only true "long travel" set-up is a laeger t-pin.

I'm in the same situation as you. I'll probably be going with long travel

why would you say that?

[K_Fulk]

Originally posted by DUNEZRUNNER
So by it being a Long shock setup and not long travel does that mean that the wheel travel is not increased over the standard extended a-arms, and only the length of the shock is increased?

Thomas

You got it.

[NacsMXer]

Honest question: With LT shocks, it seems as if there is more travel in the shock itself between the bottom-out bumper and the end of the shock body than on a standard 16 inch shock. Is this true? If it is, then the LT shock gives you more shock travel and tuneability correct? So it would be the A-Arms that are limiting the actual wheel travel due to the range of motion in the ball joints? :confused:

[TBD]

Long shock arms and std. arms can have the same wheel travel. Yes, the leager t pin does have the most potential for wheel travel. My ball joint arms can swing 14.5 inchs. You should remember that it's not the amount of wheel travel, it's the quality of travel that is important. When I first started building suspension components I thought more travel was always better. I had a TRX250R with 14.5 inchs in the rear and 14 inchs in front and could not get it to work well. I ended up with 12.75 inchs in the front and 13 inchs in the rear and the difference in the way the shocks worked was night and day. The biggest thing you gain with long shocks is more shaft velocity. Bieng that valving is velocity sensative that means that valving is easier to tune. Also by running a longer shock you are able to put the shock mount in such a position that you change the motion ratio and hopefully the leverage curve.

[DirtDevilBT]

But it seems that shaft travel is the same and you can still bottom the frame out on a jump with standard travel shocks/arms. So the only "extra" wheel travel you will get is in the air. You can only have as much travel as you have before you lay frame, any extra travel will be on the rebound side when the shock extends it's full length in the air.

Long travel vs. standard travel is like 500 bucks more at least. And why are the arms more is price, not any better than "standard" travel arms. Sounds like everyone is getting on the band wagon with "better means more $$". I don't know, I have been looking for a used set up to save some green, looking at about a grand for a nice used standard travel set up. You can't find used long travel set ups often.

[Meat]

Long travel vs. standard travel is like 500 bucks more at least. And why are the arms more is price, not any better than "standard" travel arms. Sounds like everyone is getting on the band wagon with "better means more $$".

I wondered this myself, why do LT arms cost $500 dollars more than reg arms. I was lectured by a guy on another forum(bansheehq.com) that "R&D" costs of the long travel A-arms are the main reason for the price increase. Sounds fishy to me.

[wilkin250r]

It's been covered already by some intelligent people, but sometimes people need to hear things more than once before they'll believe it.

A "Long Travel" setup really doesn't offer more wheel travel than a standard setup. More often than not, the ball joints on the A-arms are the limiting factor in wheel travel. The Laeger t-pin can cure this issue, but you still can't go any further than your frame hitting the ground.

If you pivot the a-arms downward further you can get more travel, but excessive down-swing causes problems with the angles of motion, wheel scrub, bump-steer, and a whole host of other issues. You can narrow the front of the frame to help cure some of the problems caused by excessive downswing, but that has it's own set of problems, and a severe impact on your wallet.

The main advantage of Long-Travel is that the shock is located further out on the a-arms, so the SHOCK is actually traveling further, with a higher shaft velocity. This gives a shock tuner much more precise control of the valving.

[DUNEZRUNNER]

I understand that part of the suspension but why would they call it long travel compared to just the extended a-arms when none of the travels are increased. From what I have read the shock shaft travel has not increased, just the body length, and the wheel travel has not increased either. I think that by being able to have more shaft travel it would also increase the tuneability of the suspension. Also from what I am taking in on this thread is that the suspension travel from std to "long travel" is actually the same and if the shock builder were good then they could set them up to perform identical.

Thomas

[TBD]

Originally posted by DUNEZRUNNER
I understand that part of the suspension but why would they call it long travel compared to just the extended a-arms when none of the travels are increased. From what I have read the shock shaft travel has not increased, just the body length, and the wheel travel has not increased either. I think that by being able to have more shaft travel it would also increase the tuneability of the suspension. Also from what I am taking in on this thread is that the suspension travel from std to "long travel" is actually the same and if the shock builder were good then they could set them up to perform identical.

Thomas First of all it really depends on the shock builder and application as far as shaft lengths go. For instance a motocross set up will most likely have less shaft travel because you would normally run smaller tires then normal. If you were having the shocks set up for desert you would have more shaft travel for the fact that you run larger diameter tires and the frame is higher off the ground. Again it depends on the shock builder and it does vary between the different builders. As far as them calling them long travel was probally because that is what the consumer was calling them maybe because they just assumed that it had more travel because it was a longer shock. Also travel will vary amongst the arm manufactures. All I'm saying is that you can get the same amount of travel out of both styles of arms.

[wilkin250r]

Originally posted by DUNEZRUNNER
I understand that part of the suspension but why would they call it long travel compared to just the extended a-arms when none of the travels are increased. From what I have read the shock shaft travel has not increased, just the body length, and the wheel travel has not increased either.

No, the shaft travel of the shock HAS increased. The shock itself has longer travel, because the shock mount is located further out on the A-arm.

Here's a simple example, obviously not to perfect scale. The top shows standard travel as the the wheel travels about 6 inches, the shock only compresses about 2 inches.

The bottom shows the SAME 6 inches of wheel travel, but the shock compresses about 4.5 inches, because the shock mount is located further out. As you can see, the SHOCK travel has increased, but the wheel travel has not.