400ex, still competitive?

[ZQ8Dude]

in a month or so im looking to buy a quad. am personally after a Z400, but the dealer i plan to buy will probably have a 400ex for dirt cheap. when the Z400 first came out they had one for like 3500 on sticker or so because they just couldnt move them.

essentially i plan to buy it and do some mudding/trailing as well as do some MXing with it, but i cant decide what i should get. i should have the money for both, but that low price is tempting.

also i plan to race a friend with a z400, but if his car driving skills translate to his atv riding, i could eat him alive on a 300ex

[wilkin250r]

It will take a few bucks to make the 400EX faster than the z400, I don't think a pipe and filter will do it. A pipe, filter, piston and cam would certainly do the trick.

When you start getting into major mods, it equalizes the playing field. If you put a thousand into each motor, and a 1500 in to the suspension on each quad, they would be pretty much equal, and certainly able to run circles around stock machines.

Reverse is handy, so that may be a deciding factor. The 400EX is a little more popular for MX than the Z400, I imagine there is a reason for it.

[ZQ8Dude]

well the reverse would be nice, but again its most keeping the cost down.

also what kinda motor mods are we talking? like boring and stroking? i had planned on seeing if the local track had a mostly stock class to race in, since im gonna be getting the hang of the quad for awhile, and not racing a whole alot.

ive never noticed the 400ex being more popular for MX, other then the fact that their were so many built and sold in its prime days of owning the racing quad field

[wilkin250r]

Major mods would include a big bore beyond the stock sleeve, like a 440. High compression that requires race gas, an aggressive race cam (rather than a mild cam) and headwork, port and flow, oversized valves, accompanied by an aftermarket carb. A stroker would certainly fit into the realm of "major engine mods"

Two stock machines, side by side racing in an uphill sand drag (the ultimate power shootout), the z400 would win over a 400EX. It would take more than a pipe and filter on the EX to beat the z400.

Put the same two bikes, each with 465cc big-bore and stroker kits, headwork, camshafts, and carbs, on that same uphill sand drag and I don't think you'll see a clearly defined winner.

[Atreyu]

In a staight drag the Z will take it by 1-3 quad lengths. You could buy the 400 and have some cash left over to buy some minor mods. OR you could buy the Z and mod it over time. It's all up to you in the end.

[khen]

Originally posted by wilkin250r
Major mods would include a big bore beyond the stock sleeve, like a 440. High compression that requires race gas, an aggressive race cam (rather than a mild cam) and headwork, port and flow, oversized valves, accompanied by an aftermarket carb. A stroker would certainly fit into the realm of "major engine mods"

Two stock machines, side by side racing in an uphill sand drag (the ultimate power shootout), the z400 would win over a 400EX. It would take more than a pipe and filter on the EX to beat the z400.

Put the same two bikes, each with 465cc big-bore and stroker kits, headwork, camshafts, and carbs, on that same uphill sand drag and I don't think you'll see a clearly defined winner. My 400EX with a Megamax exhaust, powerbomb header and K&N filter/modded air box beat a stock Z400 up Sandmountain Utah quite handedly. :confused: My brother just bought a KFX400 and although we haven't officially lined up and drag raced yet, we have raced around tracks and I'm at least as fast as him if not faster and I weigh 50lbs more than he does. I think stock for stock with the same level of rider the Z would edge out the EX but if the EX is jetted correctly with an exhaust and airbox mod should be able to take a stock Z.

When the Z first came out all the mags and the talk was that it totally whooped up on an EX, I think more and more people are finding out through their own experiences that is not the case at all. The Z has a slight edge stock but not that much.

If they were both selling for the same price I would most likely go with the Z, because of reverse. But if the Z was even $300 more than the EX I would buy the EX. This is of course assuming they were the same year and in the same condition.

[400exrules]

Originally posted by khen
My 400EX with a Megamax exhaust, powerbomb header and K&N filter/modded air box beat a stock Z400 up Sandmountain Utah quite handedly. :confused: My brother just bought a KFX400 and although we haven't officially lined up and drag raced yet, we have raced around tracks and I'm at least as fast as him if not faster and I weigh 50lbs more than he does. I think stock for stock with the same level of rider the Z would edge out the EX but if the EX is jetted correctly with an exhaust and airbox mod should be able to take a stock Z.

When the Z first came out all the mags and the talk was that it totally whooped up on an EX, I think more and more people are finding out through their own experiences that is not the case at all. The Z has a slight edge stock but not that much.

If they were both selling for the same price I would most likely go with the Z, because of reverse. But if the Z was even $300 more than the EX I would buy the EX. This is of course assuming they were the same year and in the same condition.

very well said

[SRH]

i raced a 400ex for 3 years.....ur better off not getting one to race......z 400, 450r or yfz would be the only quads id pick to race...if you only choosing between the z 400 and 400ex id get the z 400, ive ridden a z 400 with ct racing pipe and its power on a mx track was way better than my 416ex was...it felt like torque similar to a yfz but it signed off quick and wasnt as forceful, but you put say 2-3k in a 400ex motor and make it a 440 national motor and then do a 450 to the suzuki for the same price there will be no comparison, the handling is similar on each, the new z looks really nice, lil more powerful motor and better suspension.... i will tell u right now the stock 400ex suspension blows, the z 400 looks similar to yfz suspension which isnt that bad and you will get bored of 400ex power after a month...and it doesnt respond well to motor mods....you do a crazy 465 motor or really hot 440 kit and you will kill the life of the bottom end....


if you werent interested in mx id say get the 400ex but since you may wanan get into mx racing and u ride mx id definetly go with z 400... you might as well start in reverse if your going to race a 400ex...beleive me ur hhurting yourself by racing one when i switched to yfz i did way better and didnt feel i had to improve anything and my 400ex felt like it needed everything...

[ZQ8Dude]

thanks, this has given me most of the info i need, looks like i wont be picking up a 400ex unless they have one for 3grand or less.

especially with the z400 getting a power update and some really nice shocks, doesnt seem worth it get a 400ex

[khen]

I don't know, I went out to scope out a local track last night and there were 2 motos for ATV's there were 6 YFZ's, 1 Z400, 1 KFX400, 1 450R, 1 400EX, 1 Cannondale and a few others.

In the first moto the Z400 won followed closely by the Cannondale and the 400EX. In the second moto the Cannondale won followed closely by the 450R then a YFZ(the 400EX didn't race the second moto).

This was the Intermediate level race mind you(no one raced in the A class). But still it goes to prove that they all still compete at this level. It is 90% rider.

Also there is no way in he!! a Z400 in reverse would even come close to a 400EX, comments like that don't help anyone. :rolleyes:

[SRH]

Originally posted by khen
I don't know, I went out to scope out a local track last night and there were 2 motos for ATV's there were 6 YFZ's, 1 Z400, 1 KFX400, 1 450R, 1 400EX, 1 Cannondale and a few others.

In the first moto the Z400 won followed closely by the Cannondale and the 400EX. In the second moto the Cannondale won followed closely by the 450R then a YFZ(the 400EX didn't race the second moto).

This was the Intermediate level race mind you(no one raced in the A class). But still it goes to prove that they all still compete at this level. It is 90% rider.

Also there is no way in he!! a Z400 in reverse would even come close to a 400EX, comments like that don't help anyone. :rolleyes:


yeah some guys can ride 400exs and win on them but why knowingly put yourself at a disadvantage....

[khen]

I agree, but the disadvantage is more apparent in the more advanced classes. If I was building a quad to race in a competitive 'A' class or pro class I would either buy a used Z400 and put a Yoshi kit in it, or a YFZ or 450R. Any of which I would upgrade the suspension on.

I think what makes the Z competitive(as seen by Gust) is the Yoshi kit.

I will change my comment above about the $300 break point between the Z and EX. I thought he was talking used quads. If I were looking at new Z's or EX's I would pay $600 more for a Z because of the upgraded engine and suspension.

[RIDER11X]

OR, buy a modded 400ex for cheap. They are out there as many are switching to the 450's. There is something great in beating people with my 400ex, like when I smoked Crazy Honda 3 times in a row on his Brand New Stock YFZ. He almost cried.

A well built 416ex with good suspension is definitly a threat to alot of machines. Plus they are aircooled so they are simpler to work on.:cool:

[khen]

Originally posted by RIDER11X
OR, buy a modded 400ex for cheap. They are out there as many are switching to the 450's. There is something great in beating people with my 400ex, like when I smoked Crazy Honda 3 times in a row on his Brand New Stock YFZ. He almost cried.

A well built 416ex with good suspension is definitly a threat to alot of machines. Plus they are aircooled so they are simpler to work on.:cool: I agree with that completely! Sometimes you can find used 400EX's with built engines and Elka suspension setups for $3 - $3.5k. If hindsight was 20/20 I would have bought a built used 400EX over a new one in a hurry! I also like the air/oil cooled engine for it's simplicity and durability.

[Florida400EX]

The 2005 400ex has reverse also, but I would never buy another 400ex, waste of time, no matter how you put it, they can't keep up with a 450.

[RIDER11X]

Originally posted by Florida400EX
The 2005 400ex has reverse also, but I would never buy another 400ex, waste of time, no matter how you put it, they can't keep up with a 450. Yea, but the thing that puts me off about the new 450's is the high maintenance. My ex is trouble free for the most part, and still puts out plenty of power for me.;)

[ZQ8Dude]

you couldnt pay me to buy an 05 400ex, adds reverse. but gains 11lbs. while the 05 Z400 is at 375lbs dry weight and is getting added power this year. and costs about the same


but anyways i guess ill have to see, may end up with an older Z400 or 05 if im lucky.

so far it seems like its not too worth it for a 400ex, atleast while looking to do some racing in it

[Metzroth]

Well, I'm no expert but I bought my used 400ex about 3 months ago. I have been riding whenever I have the chance and have never had any problems other than me being an idiot and hitting the kill switch on accident every now and then :blah: but I've ridden the Z and if your super serious about MX then deffinitley go for the z. But if you want something comfortable and trouble free, with plenty of power for recreational riding I would go with the EX. It's super easy to get used to lots of fun to ride and low maintenance. Lots of mods available and like it was said b4 it's 90% rider. Depends on what you really wanna do. Hope this helps.

[ZQ8Dude]

well, now im not too sure about the mx thing. the ohv park i plan to ride at has 2 MX tracks. one for practice(thats open to both atvs and dirtbikes) and another track thats used for practice and big MX events. but i have yet to find anything that says they do organized quad racing. i emailed the group that organizes the races to find out whether or not they do atv racing there.

anyways, if they dont do racing, then the bike of my choice will be mostly for racing my friends stock Z400. who more then likely sucks at atv handling, considering he sucks at handling in a car.
as well as racing my co-workers predator 500 and then the many misc. quads i might come across who wanna race

[Metzroth]

Well the 400ex is really versatile you can use it for whatever. The Z is fun too but, it needs more maintenance.

[Metzroth]

Also you can maybe spend the difference on what it would cost to buy the Z on the EX and it would be just as powerful.

[Kennethyfz450]

Before I got my Yfz i thought the 400ex was the best thing since slice bread it did everything i wanted to do and more it handle great jumped good and was a decent hill climber......

the z400 never caught my attention but as far as putting it in a class with a yfz450 or 450r i want to laugh.. it has potential but who wants to spend all that money?? also i know doug is winning those races but he could win those races on a 400ex if it had a 450 kit installed.. its all about the rider..

i would get the honda 400ex, or yfz 450 that you can get around 5999.00 if you know where to shop at around your area.

before i get the z 400 i would get the pred..

[DEAL]

By the time you buy a 400ex and do enough to it so it will keep up with a z,yfz, or 450r you will be well over a cost of any of those quads.
Don't get me wrong, I love my 400 but its not worth going out and buying a new one to race anymore.

[SRH]

Originally posted by Kennethyfz450
Before I got my Yfz i thought the 400ex was the best thing since slice bread it did everything i wanted to do and more it handle great jumped good and was a decent hill climber......

the z400 never caught my attention but as far as putting it in a class with a yfz450 or 450r i want to laugh.. it has potential but who wants to spend all that money?? also i know doug is winning those races but he could win those races on a 400ex if it had a 450 kit installed.. its all about the rider..

i would get the honda 400ex, or yfz 450 that you can get around 5999.00 if you know where to shop at around your area.

before i get the z 400 i would get the pred..

you havent ridden a z 400 have u? and in the diference in price between a z 400 and 400ex you could not make the 400ex faster.... 400ex will be slow always be slow no matter how much cash u dump in, if u finally make it fast the tranny will die as for maintence there is hardly any more maintence to a z 400, just change the oil regularly, adjust the chain....normal stuff, chain adjustment is a lil harder on a z but thats about it, you have liquid cooling that might be the only added maintence if you can even call it that the 400ex is a great quad but i would only want one for play riding and trails...

[ZQ8Dude]

i wont do polaris, everytime i see a predator, i can help but thing of the other polaris atvs, that are sub-par to say the least

dont want a YZF it nice, but its a pure racer, and i really dont need that now. plus its more then i really want to spend. if i get to the point of needing to keep up with a 450F/R ill just add the yoshirma 450 kit

i dont see why you laugh, the yzf and R only put like what 40rwhp and the Z puts roughly 30rwhp(give or take in conditions) plus a bore kit is bound to get you way over 40hp

[RIDER11X]

Originally posted by ZQ8Dude
i wont do polaris, everytime i see a predator, i can help but thing of the other polaris atvs, that are sub-par to say the least

dont want a YZF it nice, but its a pure racer, and i really dont need that now. plus its more then i really want to spend. if i get to the point of needing to keep up with a 450F/R ill just add the yoshirma 450 kit

i dont see why you laugh, the yzf and R only put like what 40rwhp and the Z puts roughly 30rwhp(give or take in conditions) plus a bore kit is bound to get you way over 40hp

And the 400ex is around 28 RWHP, and about 42hp with a TC416 MX kit. :p

[allmixedup047]

you can get an R for around $5,500 now if you shop around. i know around here the z's are around $5,200. its only $300 more for the r, plus you will smoke your buddies stock z. the only stock z that i found that could hang with me was a kid i know that is 15yrs old and all he does is ride, he has the yoshi full system and he is a complete badass on a quad. if he was on an equal quad as mine he would wax my ***. hes 15yrs old and already doing supermans over a 60ft double, along with heelclickers, nacnacs, and cancans. after riding my quad he found out how much faster he was on the r and he wants one now. not saying everyone would be faster on an R, i just know he is.:macho

[ZQ8Dude]

to tell you the truth, i dont really want an R or a yzf. im not really fond of the styling on the R. and their both pure race bikes. considering i havent been on a quad in awhile. i dont think i need it. not to mention that if the ohv park does do racing, id rather start with something thats not too wild like a 400ex or Z400

granted if i could find a good price i would buy one of them regardless, but good friggin luck here in cali. not with raptors being 6400 starting and probably over 7 OTD. according to the dealer i plan to buy from, generally has the best deals around. for an 04 450R its: 6499 starting. everyone else will be higher, garanteed

furthermore, if i spank my friend in a race badly enough, he probably wont wanna race again. probably get pissed because he cant drive...similar to when we use to 4x4, he couldnt drive his truck and i could drive my jeep like a pro....didnt go offroad too much lol


as for the horsepower thing with the EXvsZ, im really getting confused. ive been bouncing off and on between here and a Z board. it seems to show that both bikes weight the same and put out similar outputs. yet according to people here aswell as on the Z board, the Z outperforms the EX. so im lead to think gearing. does anyone know what the 1st-5th gear ratios are as well as the final drive(swingarm gear) for both of these quads.

if they're the same then i friggin give up on understanding how the heck one is faster then the other

[allmixedup047]

i know your delima man, i went through the same thing with the r and the yfz. i could get them both for the same price so it took other things to make my ming up.
this is the deal, the 400ex and the z400 are so close in performance its not going to matter what you get. get what you think fits you better, which one feels better to ride. what ever you pick you will be more than happy with. you cant go wrong with any of these bikes out today. they will all fit to be good recreation quads. the z has reverse and liquid cooling. personaly i dont ever use reverse and the 400ex has no problems with its air cooling. the 400ex has proven itself over and over again in all catogories as for the Z as well. dont listen to anyone but yourself when you go pick out your quad. im the only person out of my riding group with my R, everyone else has yfz's. i wouldnt trade my R for there yfz's anytime. the ex will keep up with the z in all aspects that you will be needing it for. so get the one you feel more comfortable on, and the one that fits your riding style the most, where you spend most of the time on the seat.

[JR3]

it is the indian not the arrow

[RIDER11X]

Originally posted by ZQ8Dude


if they're the same then i friggin give up on understanding how the heck one is faster then the other

The Ex is SOHC (Single Over Head Cam) and the Z is DOHC (Dual Over Head Cam). That and the Z is built lighter inside the motor to allow it to rev quicker, which allows you to get to the next gear sooner. Ex's commonly have their flywheels lightened when in for serious motor work to get similar gains. Hope that clears it up for you.:cool:

[ZQ8Dude]

ah gotcha, hadnt really thought about that

[Kennethyfz450]

Some people read magazines to much.

What i dont understand so many people think the z400 is in the class with the R , YFZ and the 400ex isn't

i dont see any any difference in either one of them besides I FAVOR the 400ex more. the 400ex and the z 400 has really no horsepower difference and anyone could win in a drag race. what so many forgot is the z400 is almost an exAct copy of a 400ex just with a drz motor on it BUT it seats a little hower and they had bad front shock mounts or something a long time ago.. the power difference is not that big of a deal like someone said just shave the flywheel and it will rev just a quick as the z if not quicker ..

Go out and ride both you can get 400ex dirt cheap used.. and also the new 400ex has reverse but they changed the plastic and made it look stupid. ..

anyhow good luck

i been on a few z400's in my day
one also rear ended me on my yfz

[allmixedup047]

What i dont understand so many people think the z400 is in the class with the R , YFZ and the 400ex isn't

well said
and one thing i dont understand is when people think the 450r isnt in a class with the yfz. they are closer than the ex is to the z.

[ZQ8Dude]

i dont think its a matter of the 450R being in the same class as the YZF, but the fact that honda boasted so much about it, and it failed to beat the YZF.

as i said before, theres no way id buy an 05 400ex, sure it got reverse, but it gained 11lbs, looks awful and the Z400 is gonna eat it alive. especially with it being lightened this year and with some power mods.

also think of it this way, what happens when you shave the flywheel on the Z400?

i do plan to ride both, hopefully the cycle place im gonna visit wont **** bricks if i ask to test ride one of each(being that im 18)

[allmixedup047]

but the fact that honda boasted so much about it, and it failed to beat the YZF.

HP, the yfz has it by one hp
torque, trx has the yfz by six ft pounds
max rpm's, the yfz has it by 1000
top speed, the trx has it by 2

failed to beat it, but didnt get beat.
these tests where done by a company in arizona i think

[ZQ8Dude]

but honda needed a kickstart to get down to the yzfs weight. thats one thing turns me away from honda. their bikes always seem to be on the heavy side, and cutting a corner like no electric start is unacceptable imho (though everyone see's things differently)

id say it got beat, it wasnt spanked by any means and is very close, but honda failed....especially dawning the "R" name again. you'd think they wouldve went overboard with it

[allmixedup047]

especially dawning the "R" name again

the R name never started out the best. heres the facts, the 250r was in dead last place when it came out in 86. the lt250r and the tacate over powered it and out handled it. like ive said befor, specs dont mean much when the hammer drops and its out with the front pack, if not out in front by itself, i dont ride the specs sheet, i ride a quad. it was the reliability that over the years put the R on top. im not trying to start a war im just stating facts. the yfz took short cuts as well. for example, they wanted it lower So they made those a-arms. half square tube half round tube:huh . i know how close the r and the yfz are, very! and the yamaha out weighs the honda. my buddy just took his electric start off of his yfz because of the weight factor. hondas intentions were a full on race quad and thats was the reasoning for the kick start. i know its far from it but its a damn good base to work with.

[Dunesurfer]

If you get the Z400 make sure you buy an extended warrenty, All my friends that have them needed to replace the cam chain tensioner. It seems to be a problem with them. I owned a honda 400ex and it was ok, but it took some work to make it fast(426 kit, pipe, cam, ect.) I have ridden both alot and they both have strong points. The honda is dirt cheap, won't break down but is slow and can overheat. The z400 is more high tech but that cam chain problem scares me away from it. I ride a Predator now and honestly it smokes them both for about the same $$ just get a 04 or o5. Good luck with whatever you get, either way you will be having fun.:D

[allmixedup047]

not saying this is all predators but the only 2 people that i know that have them have had major problems with them. both of them had the trany go out.

[ZQ8Dude]

ok got a new indecision. 450R vs Z400, vs 400ex.

went down the dealer today before school. they want 5600 for the 04 R, 5700 for the 05 Z(56 for 04) and MYBO on the 400ex(make your best offer) so i could probably get one for like 3500-4k sticker. guy even said all they wanna do is get rid of them because their not selling(even had 4+ more back in the gates when i was leaving)


can anyone tell me what pecent is taxing and licensing? so i can figure out an OTD cost

[allmixedup047]

went down the dealer today before school. they want 5600 for the 04 R, 5700 for the 05 Z(56 for 04) and MYBO on the 400ex(make your best offer) so i could probably get one for like 3500-4k sticker. guy even said all they wanna do is get rid of them because their not selling(even had 4+ more back in the gates when i was leaving)

they want more for the z than the r.:huh wow. im not you but i would go with the r way before i went with the z for that. its your money and your quad though. do what you want.

[ZQ8Dude]

well its 04 compared to 05. the 05s are gonna be at some crazy *** price when they get them in.

but right now i am leaning towards the R if they have it at that price when i scrape together my down payment money

and also why im trying to find the OTD price so i can calculate my payment at various interest rates

[allmixedup047]

didnt you say you didnt like the look of the R. does this help?:blah: :macho :D

[ZQ8Dude]

i dont, but i could learn to love it for that price :blah:

plus if i could find a yzf for that insane price, id be all over that first

[allmixedup047]

or does this one help?:eek2:

[allmixedup047]

they went for that around here. i had a big decision to make then between the yfz and the trx. i love my r but i like the yfz also.:D

[ZQ8Dude]

allmixedup- they went for that price all year long?

btw, eww on the last picture. i cant stand cut fenders, that can uglify any quad

[RIDER11X]

Originally posted by Kennethyfz450
Some people read magazines to much.

What i dont understand so many people think the z400 is in the class with the R , YFZ and the 400ex isn't

i dont see any any difference in either one of them besides I FAVOR the 400ex more. the 400ex and the z 400 has really no horsepower difference and anyone could win in a drag race. what so many forgot is the z400 is almost an exAct copy of a 400ex just with a drz motor on it BUT it seats a little hower and they had bad front shock mounts or something a long time ago.. the power difference is not that big of a deal like someone said just shave the flywheel and it will rev just a quick as the z if not quicker ..


I agree! I got my 400ex and run with them all in 95% of all conditions........Open stretches, 450's will pull away, but most of the time it's MORE about the rider. A recent harescramble I races with all of these machines on the line, 12 total, I was 4th going into the woods off of the start! Not too shabby for an OUTDATED machine, eh? Like someone said, I ride the quad, not the spec sheet, or the propoganda put forth by the magazine articles. If a 400ex guy holds the hammer down a couple seconds longer than his 450cc competitor has the guts to, the outcome changes quickly.
Just be proud of whatever you ride, as they all got weak points, and are all capable of putting you out in front with the proper skills.:cool:

[allmixedup047]

btw, eww on the last picture. i cant stand cut fenders, that can uglify any quad
:huh :eek2: :( :grr: :mad: WHAT? im sorry but that is one of the best looking quads i have ever seen. no matter what i would ride. but yeah, the yfz and the trx's are the saem price at one dealership in missouri. for a while the yfz's where cheaper because they were not selling. the 450's go for around 5600otd.

[allmixedup047]

and btw the z's and kfx's go for around 5100. around here

[allmixedup047]

Just be proud of whatever you ride, as they all got weak points, and are all capable of putting you out in front with the proper skills.

well said. and very true.

[ZQ8Dude]

sorry, i just dont dig cut fenders, it might be functional and all, but it really makes the quad look funky

i wish i wasnt in Ca, everything is overpriced here.

though the 400ex is still on my mind, for such a low price....especially if my track doesnt do ATV MX(still not sure of)

[allmixedup047]

sorry, i just dont dig cut fenders
everyone is intitled to there own opinion. and i dont think they really serve a purpose, i just think they look good. and you know deep down in yout heart that black 450r is frickin sweet.:blah:

[RIDER11X]

Originally posted by allmixedup047
or does this one help?:eek2:

If I was a duner, or lived near the dunes.......I'd bet the 450r would be the way to go. That is a super sweet ride!:macho

[ZQ8Dude]

deep down i am....i am thinking that would be a great quad for the avid woman nudist to be riding! so she cant hide anything ;) :blah:

anyways can anyone help with what % is tax and licensing here in the sucky state of Ca

[allmixedup047]

does this do anything for ya.:macho

[RIDER11X]

Originally posted by allmixedup047
does this do anything for ya.:macho
Ooooooooooohhhhhhh Yeah! It does for me!:D :D :D

[ZQ8Dude]

OOOOHHH i want herr....err RRR....err maybe i had it right the first time

but noticed no shaved fenders...not a nudist :blah:

[RIDER11X]

Originally posted by ZQ8Dude


but noticed no shaved fenders...not a nudist :blah:

How did you notice the fenders? :huh







:p

[allmixedup047]

this is dans 416 that im sure he would sell to you. hes getting an R and might keep this for his wife. she small and would rip on this quad if she had some more seat time. but its for sale for the right price.

[ZQ8Dude]

easy, my computer loads to the last post automaticly, so i saw the quad before the fantastic ride :D

[ZQ8Dude]

thanks but no thanx, i dont want used. anyways i was talking with my dad and around here tax/licens. should be about 500 bucks max.

so id be at 6100OTD for a 450R or Z and probably like 4-4500otd on an EX.

tomorrow im going to start cleaning my space of the garage and in 3 weeks im gonna look to buy. my dad wanted me to get 2500, but i found that 500 bucks makes a difference of 10 bucks in my payment...which really isnt a whole lot for my situation.

then im gonna haggle and try to get the best price for all 3 and decide what i want. also visit the yami dealer for SandGs

btw, how is the kickstarter? PITA or nice? how about in the dead heat in the dunes?

my dad is kinda stuck on having reverse as well as hating kickstarts(from his old bikes) though he probably will never ride it, he is trying to warn me of this and thats so i will love my bike as much as possible

[allmixedup047]

the kick on the 450r is very very easy. it has hot start so after you have been ridding it hard, you just hold in that button and it should kick over every time. when its been sitting you dont need it though. if its been sitting over night, i use the choke and one kick. starts every time, and thats no joke. i get a lot of crap from my buddies that have yfz's about my kickstarter. so i took my best friends sister ( she is 15 and about 110pounds) and had her kickstart it, to my surprise it started on the first kick for her, and it was in gear, which usualy takes about 2 kicks. i have had a couple girls start my quad just to prove a point to some people. i mean i can kick it sitting down like its nothing, its second nature to me now. and you know whats funny is one of my friends with the yfz got rid of his electric start and put a kick starter on his, it has no compression release like the 450r does, and it takes him around 10 kicks, no joke. and he is standing on the kicker trying to shove it down.

[CrashBailey]

My uncle just bough a brand new 400z and my 400ex when i first got it (which was pretty well worn in, with its decompressor stuck on) with a s bend eseries pipe and k&n filter wouldve embarassed him. id go for the ex cheaper easier to hop up, just cant go wrong with that.:devil:

[ZQ8Dude]

lol, see thats what my dad as well as myself would be afraid of. i remember the old 250 honda dirtbike he was fixing, that thing took awhile and the kickback was painful

[allmixedup047]

yeah, ive been caught once with the kickstart and it shoved my knee into the bars. the very first time i ever started it at the dealership to put it in the truck, i was like god damn, take this thing back. but my problem was i was holding in the gas when i was trying to start it, so i was loading it up. you never need to hold the gas in to start it.

[ZQ8Dude]

thanks for the tip lol!

but thats not too bad, my friend had his 80cc dirtbike kick back and rip skin off his toe :D (tried starting it barefooted)

btw on loading ramps, this is kind of a dumb Q but are they bolt on? and how do the safety chains work? atleast on yours

im a little too anal about my trucks appearance to drill anything onto the bed or risk a chain scratching my paint(brand new truck, anything but a beater)

[allmixedup047]

i have aluminum ramps. they are 6ft and fold in half, very light and they fit under my quad in the bed of the truck between the quads wheelbase. i use tie straps on my quad, like ratchet straps. i hook them at the top of the bed up front(you know those 3 holes on either side of the bed that go all the way down it) i use the front holes and hook the strap there and then on my foot pegs and pull it tight all the way to the frony of the bed so it cant go foward or backwords nor side to side.

[ZQ8Dude]

do the ramps just rest on the tailgate?

securing isnt a problem, ive hauled several utilities back when i use to avidly ride, but i was never fond of the ramps my grandpa used, they looked like it'd be too easy to have them slip off and roll the quad back on you

[allmixedup047]

and earlier you said you dont really want a full on race quad like the R or YFZ because you havnt been on a quad in a while. well after about a month on a 400ex or a z you will be looking to mod it, this site doesnt help for the cause either. if i where you and was wanting a used bike i would go for gold, skip the bs, dont beat around the bush. get the faster bike like the R or the YFZ. might as well pay the extra couple hundred bucks now, because later it would take well more than a couple hundred to compete with these two quads. and im talking in all aspects, motor and suspension.

[allmixedup047]

the ramps i have, they have little tabs that are angled to fit flat on the bed and the ramps wont move as long as they are on good ground. i use them on gravel all the time, i just check how sturdy the ramps are befor i load the quad. and i dont push it up there, i ride it.

[allmixedup047]

oh, yes they rest on the tail gate

[ZQ8Dude]

yeah and price played a major factor in it. and it still does, if i go back with my money and they want like 6+ for an R im not even gonna bother. 6500 OTD is my limit for this bike.

btw, im not looking at used. im just looking at the last year models they didnt sell off. i dont like used for things that are modded/shade tree mechanic maintained. went through that with my jeep. took me a whole school year to clear up all of my wiring troubles it had(was wired by a man with his head up his ***) as well as the various engine quarks i came across that just screamed out how badly this guy knew nothing of cars

[allmixedup047]

ask them if you could give them like 100bucks now to reserve the R for you. all the dealerships around here will do that. and tell them you will have the money at a certain time and if not they can keep the cash and put the quad back on the floor.

[allmixedup047]

ask them if they will match prices, and if so, feed them a line of BS about how you aunt lives out here in missouri and your going to be going out there anyway in a couple of weeks and there is a dealership out there that has them for 5600otd. then they will call the dealership and the dealership will say yes we sell them for that price all year round. then they will give you the price you want bacause they want your business, they know if they sell you a quad all the other business comes with that, like oil, and the little things you will be stoping in there for once a week for.

[86350x]

I rode cleanshaves 440 2 weeks ago now, wasn't far off from the new 450's. Ripped pretty good. There still competetive if you put a little time and money into them.

You can get a used one with work already done to them cheap here in michigan. Still one of the most popular bikes out here.

[ZQ8Dude]

maybe i will pull that. or maybe try the "well i was set on the 450R because of the price, but now maybe ill go buy a YZF450" and start to walk out(but not before wasting 20-30minutes of the salesmens time)

its a zuk/hond/kawi dealer :devil:

[allmixedup047]

yeah and when you dont get what you want, just say well i will see you later. bye. they will always work with you more. and dont settle for more than 6.9%, my mom has perfect credit and she was buying my quad for me, they told her they could only get 13%. she said i have perfect credit, bye. they said well hold on let me make a phone call, it wasnt 20 seconds later he said i got you 6.9%. the dealerships get kick backs from honda if they screw someone on there intrest rates.

[ZQ8Dude]

oh yeah its kinda like buying a car if i did the walk out thing, id leave a cell number incase they could do the price. then claim i was going after a yamaha(then go have lunch)

[Kennethyfz450]

I tried to do that crazy junk ... i told my dealership i was going to go to tenn to by my yfz450 for 5999.00 so he said 6200 and bunch of other garbage i came back he wanted to charge tax licence fee and set up charges.. sorry to say i am no longer wanted at the dealership and got kicked out a few months ago...

i am glad that you are buying the R over the z400 i was starting to worry about you for a second;)

[sharkinthepool]

Originally posted by ZQ8Dude
in a month or so im looking to buy a quad. am personally after a Z400, but the dealer i plan to buy will probably have a 400ex for dirt cheap. when the Z400 first came out they had one for like 3500 on sticker or so because they just couldnt move them.

essentially i plan to buy it and do some mudding/trailing as well as do some MXing with it, but i cant decide what i should get. i should have the money for both, but that low price is tempting.

also i plan to race a friend with a z400, but if his car driving skills translate to his atv riding, i could eat him alive on a 300ex

I do not know exactly how to break this to you. But 90% of the posts you are going to read after asking such a question are not totally accurate.

Now before everyone that has posted anything on hear about racing a 400ex head to head with ANYTHING pops a vein.

Think about the two riders and their abilities!

The 400 or 4??ex is still competitive! It is who is on it that makes it un-competitive!

If Dana Creech or Tim Farr ( or anyone that has rode for most of their lives ) was on a 400 and someone that just started riding a month or two ago (but has watched all the videos:huh ), was on a 450 or anything you want to say by any manufacturer. The un-experienced rider is still going to get stomped during a race.

It is all about what you want and what you are prepared to do and for what reason. The Major difference is that the Z has water cooling. Maybe that is not so important on an MX track but that will make a great deal of difference on a Harescramble as the day wears on or at an endurance race of some kind. I know at the 6 and 12 hour races I would rather have something, anything that was water cooled.

Good luck on your venture,
And I hope no one got offended by this post

[ZQ8Dude]

Originally posted by Kennethyfz450
I tried to do that crazy junk ... i told my dealership i was going to go to tenn to by my yfz450 for 5999.00 so he said 6200 and bunch of other garbage i came back he wanted to charge tax licence fee and set up charges.. sorry to say i am no longer wanted at the dealership and got kicked out a few months ago...

i am glad that you are buying the R over the z400 i was starting to worry about you for a second;)

i still might if they wont cut a deal, and i do plan to visit the yami dealer there just to see if they will work for a 450 because id much rather have a yzf then a 450R

also, i could care less if they kicked me out months after i bought the quad, because this dealership is far away, like an hour away. but theres always a 500-1000 price difference between them and the other dealers around here

sharkin- i understand your post, but more then likely i wont race that many pro riders out at my area and im nothing close to even a moderate rider, so the bike capability matters right now

[sharkinthepool]

Originally posted by ZQ8Dude
[B

sharkin- i understand your post, but more then likely i wont race that many pro riders out at my area and im nothing close to even a moderate rider, so the bike capability matters right now [/B]


Well I was getting to the point that as your skill level increases you will find that it does not take as much motor or horsepower to ride, outrun, outride, or beat another rider that has the bigger bike.
Heck the only time I ever see a real pro rider is at Beans when Tim Farr is up there throwing dirt all over everybody.

Hey man Good luck on whatever you pick!!! I hope you enjoy it for what you are buying it for!!!

I figured I was going to get blasted on that earlier comment but evidentially I put it so it was understandable!

[ZQ8Dude]

i got your point, but with the price being so low on a 450R its hard to pass up. not saying i wont look into the MYBO 400ex first, but i doubt ill get one unless the price is insanely low

also another thing is that my friend will wanna drag race when we get i get mine. i atleast wanna break even with his bike


but i must say, this patience thing is killing me! with having to wait 3 weeks before i can go try and buy one

[MY450R]

GET THE R and you'll be happy
and you guys use ramps??
you cant put it on the truck by yourself

[ZQ8Dude]

Originally posted by MY450R
GET THE R and you'll be happy
and you guys use ramps??
you cant put it on the truck by yourself

yeah i could but im not willing to scratch my truck while back it out

[Metzroth]

WTF are u doing lifting it over the side of the bed?:blah: When I put my quad into a truck the only thing that touches the truck is the tires. Just lift the front onto the bed, then lift the rear up and roll it in.

[ZQ8Dude]

i said while rolling it out, i dont want the frame to scrape on the top of my tailgate.

[Metzroth]

Hold the *** end up and then pull it when it gets to the edge and it doesnt touch the tail gate, but its no big deal.

[ZQ8Dude]

ehhh last i looked i wasnt arnold...so ill get ramps

[440exnacsracer]

Hold the *** end up and then pull it when it gets to the edge and it doesnt touch the tail gate, but its no big deal.

thats what i do everytime, and i dont have a scratch yet, and im lifting a 440lb predator :macho

[Metzroth]

Just call me the governator I guess :devil:

[allmixedup047]

Just call me the governator I guess

what?:huh

[RIDER11X]

Originally posted by sharkinthepool
Well I was getting to the point that as your skill level increases you will find that it does not take as much motor or horsepower to ride, outrun, outride, or beat another rider that has the bigger bike.

Soooo true! Suspension means WAY more than motor too. A stock 400ex with PEP or Axis shocks is way more formidable than a 440ex on stock shocks. At least in XC racing.:cool:

[Metzroth]

He said he was no arnold (meaning Shcwarznegger) and you kno how they call him the governator? Yeah kinda like that.

[allmixedup047]

ahh, got ya.

[ZQ8Dude]

kinda of ironic, T3 was on while i read this post.

anyways yeah they call him the govenator, infact my work has a haloween mask that suppose to look like him.....unfortunately it looks like him on crack and somehow weight 400lbs

well, been 3-4 days+ since i emailed the place that organizes the big races at my track, so i guess its not really gonna matter what i buy. hopefully the R is the same price as it was. if not its gonna be Z or EX

and hopefully i will be able to ride each 3 and decide what is more to my liking for suspension and handling(i want something i can that handles great but can do some decent powerslides when im screwing around)

[allmixedup047]

can do some decent powerslides when im screwing around)

power sliding eh. lol, its a pretty good roost if you ask me. but we where kinda out of sink for the pic. oh well at least we got one off.

[ZQ8Dude]

cool, well its 2 weeks now! the patience is killing me lol

though i think i may start by give an offer on a 400ex, just ask 3k just for ****s and giggles( im gonna :huh if he goes for it)

then look into the R then the Z



btw, how stable are these bikes when you break loose the backend? most of my riding experience is on older utilities that felt uncomfortable if you got one wheel up, let alone break traction sideways

[Metzroth]

On My EX I'm comfortable riding on 2 wheels. So one wheel will not be a problem at all. The 400ex is also crazy with wheelies. Also I remember you saying u wanna beat your friend in a drag. Depending on how long u race for, you could prolly keep up if u spent $30 on a good 14T front sprocket, around $100 on a K&N power up kit. I just put the power up kit on mine not too long ago and It makes a huge difference. Also I've rode my friends stock 400ex with 14t sprocket and it improves acceleration alot. I can't say much about any of the other quads ur lookin at cuz i dont have much experience with them. I rode a friends Z and it was fun, but not enuf to say much about it. Whatever u get will be fun tho. Hope this helps some.

[allmixedup047]

my r is very stable

[ZQ8Dude]

after thinking about it, i might kill him in a drag. last time we raced cars.(my colorado, vs. his moms supercharged regal) i nearly took him because he didnt know how to launch. and an fyi, thats a mid 15 second truck racing a 14 second car

it all helps. and i must say this is one great forum for putting up with my dribble between 3 quads for 7 pages :D

also another decision factor: does the 400ex frame need to be guesseted if i plan to jump alot or is that a Z thing?

[allmixedup047]

i think its a z thing. and the regal is a 15.2 second car. my buddy has one and races it quite a bit. its quick and we love pulling up to a stop light with 4 of us in it and a civic next to us and we smoke his ***. that supercharger screams.

[ZQ8Dude]

well 14.9 with a perfect driver in perfect conditions. either way he shouldve eatan my truck alive. being that under perfect conditions im looking at 15.5 max

civics are fun no matter what! there was tons of them at the local track when i went. so funny to watch them dial in mid 15s and 14s and run like 17 something

someone mentioned that a 440 kit makes the EX kinda unreliable, ayone wanna elaborate on how it becomes unreliable and if its possible to correct it?

anyone have any snow experience with an ex?

[allmixedup047]

the 440 kit blows head gaskets quite a bit. i would go with the 416kit. you can use the stock sleve and stroker and it revs quicker. i dont think there is any way to correct it without going down on compression but then you would kind of be losing its purpose. dude if they will sell you the R for under 6grand, just go with it. you will be so happy with it you wont remember wanting anything else.

[ZQ8Dude]

but thats a big IF i dont know if ill be able to push the deal when i go looking in the next 2 weeks.

also my bad keeps claiming how much of a pita the kickstart is going to be, so i have to hope the dealer will let me start it and ride one of each. followed by starting the R a few times to really see how easy it is. im more keeping my options open. if they would go for 3 or around that for a 400ex, id pick it up before a Z400. financing 1k over 2 years lol, that'd be like 50 dollar payments lol :D

i hope there is a giant rain storm the day i get my quad because the next day will be fun

[Metzroth]

Yeah I heard the TC 416 kit is awesome. And i kno sparks 416 is good cuz they are just good. And the 416 are reliable. If done right a 440 can be reliable as well. But it will cost u. I'm perfectly happy with mine pretty much stock. But i plan on gettin a pipe and boring to a 416.

[allmixedup047]

the r will feel a little wierd probably the first time you try to start it. but after a month it will be second nature.

[ZQ8Dude]

well we'll see when i go up there. im still kinda leaning towards a 400ex for the price these days, just so im not tied up with PITA payments and such. plus i can always look into the 416/440/everything in between or above.

plus ill probably be messing around more then racing.

[SRH]

416 and 440 have hp but there not fast , they dont have the right power for mx... and for one that builds decent hp =$$$

[ZQ8Dude]

how much is $$$$?

[Dunesurfer]

400ex is the cheapest thing going right now. I saw a 03 for $2800 obo with paddles and a pipe.
If you want a good simple quad to ride a ex is a good choice if you plan on racing do yourself a favor and buy something else. Don't do what I did and dump 3-4K into it and it is still to slow. Sounds like alot but your talking $1200 for the engine work (piston, cam, borind, porting,heavy duty studs, cooling) then you ad a arms, shocks ect it ads up quick. Better to buy the newer models yammy, honda, polaris, heck even a raptor. You will be better off.

From my wife Quote" you have spent four thousand dollars this year trying to make this quad the way you want it, Just sell it and buy something faster"

Think about it;)

[QuadJunkies]

i have raced a full year (winter and summer series) and I simply LOVE my Honda. The erognomics are very tough to beat. BUT.... on a power note,the Z is def. more . I done feel comfrotable on a Z myself and do not like the lighter front end,but thats just me,for racing the Z hands down is faster . My honda is fast .... but not fast enough :(

[ZQ8Dude]

that was a big thing, but not anymore, because it seems my track doesnt do organzied racing, so this will more then likely be for racing friends on the practice track and just messing around

plus if i can get it for 3000-3500 then i wont be tied down with annoying payments and have more money to save up for little mods.

and considering my friend cant drive for anything, id kill him on an MX track or on a drag with his Z

[ZQ8Dude]

btw, how are they for the dunes? i wont be doing it much, but im sure me and a friend will get out to the closest one atleast once?(probably buy some paddles off of ebay)

[allmixedup047]

any sport quad will be fun in the dunes really. going through trails at the dunes is the funnest part and that is all rider when it comes to that.;)

[Metzroth]

Since the last time i posted on here I've killed blasters(a given) and run close with Z's, and killed warriors.. I rode a friends Z the other day, i dont know why but i dont like it, just not comfortable for me. The EX is awesome for playing around and is very comfortable and easy to ride. As for racing, I don't really plan on doing any serious organized racing, and even if i do it wont be in the experienced class or whatever, so keep in mind you dont need to get something based on how fast it can go, get it based on how much you enjoy riding it. I don't need the best. Whatever u do don't get pressured into getting the wrong quad by people telling you which one is better. Try them out and get what you like, not what someone else claims is better.

[440exnacsracer]

Try them out and get what you like, not what someone else claims is better.

i fully agree, but considering he rides with other high performance quads, i think he would quickly be tired of being beat,...and trying to get a ex faster is like a little nopi car,...no matter how much money you put in it, its still not going to compare with the newer, more technological motors, but it is still a fun quad

[ZQ8Dude]

wow this post is old. so here's my long update

was advised to wait until my truck had 6mo. worth of payments on it and it came by. so i went to look for quads. got qualified on a 400ex and was quoted at 5300otd...not a great price, but since my new plan is just for a fun/cheap bike to toy around with, it was good enough. but i had school and planned to come back in 2 days. so wednesday comes and we run up there ready to purchase. only our salesmen isnt there and the "other guy" wants 6100otd..err ofhfm(out of his **** mind) we argue and the lowest he will go is 5600. so i say right to him "well im going to suzuki down the road, bye"

unfortunately suzuki wont touch me. then to yamaha for a raptor 350(since im not racing now) but they wont touch me :( and im advised to get another 6mo. worth of payments on my truck

anyways while waiting i get a strange feeling to check the 1st dealers website for 400exs, they dropped the price to 4399, and i got quoted 4800otd rather then 5300 or 6100(bunch crooks)

anyways today i called up a local dealer and asked if they would match prices and he claimed it should be no problem as long as i can get proof(probably make them call the other dealer or go online for the price) and then ill just try to bargain in a free helmet for going to them rather then the other dealer.

if i get it tomorrow after work ill post pics.


its not the fastest but its a good starter bike, and i can always just lighten it up and add a bore kit. besides i wont be the slowest bike with my friend riding a blaster

as for racing, maybe ill just leave that for my truck, its more fun.

[Metzroth]

You wont be dissapointed 400ex is hella fun. I doubt your truck will be more fun. Trust me you dont gotta have the best to have fun. I paid 3700 for my 03 used with nerf bars and pro tapers, so dont jump on that price. You can get 440 or 416 for that price fully hooked up with suspension and everything. I know i jumped on the first thing I saw, if i hadnt i'd be sporting a 450r right now

[ZQ8Dude]

actually you'd be suprised with my truck. a magazine did a road test on it where out at a race track(road course) it spanked a V6 mustang, turbo pt cruiser and pontiac vibe

its insane fun to have a truck that handles better then some sports cars :D

i could get a used 400ex with mods, but i dont really want to. for now i want something with a warranty and something to get use to. afterall its been years since ive been on a quad. plus the quads i had ridden were either 200cc fourstroke ATCs or 300cc+ utilities(not much get up in either)

btw, as anyone tried a tranny swap to get reverse yet? i figure people here would be jumping to ty it

[Metzroth]

...Well, my EX is my first quad, I was stupid and bought it with no mods used from a dealer for 3800. It has a bend in the frame at the bumper mounts, it has a bent rear rim, but thats about the end of its problems. Since warranty is usually a limited warranty and wont let you do any mods or anything (I don't know honda's policy) it might be worth it to you to buy a used one with mods. You can pick up some cool stuff pretty cheap, I wish I had been more patient :confused: as for a tranny swap, its really not neccesairy. The ex is light enuf that u can push it out of whatever you get into. Most the time you can just spin around right on the trail. I can lift the front end of mine up and turn it around.

[ZQ8Dude]

its gonna be awhile before i get use to the bike and mod it, so no worries there. besides its for toying around.

also my other option is looking for a honda 4-stroke dirtbike. so we'll see where that goes

anyways, little update. went to the local dealer, got dicked around and didnt buy the quad simply because the guy was trying to shaft us. had 4399 msrp one place and 4500 another place. so friday morning when the shop opens we will be there to buy one

sure mines not the fastest, but mostly where il be riding will be woods stuff where top end wont matter too much