lobo II

Does anyone in hear have the roll lobo II front end. If so is it worth the money. How much better is it then the regular travel shocks on plus 2 a-arms. I am selling my dirtbike and thinking about getting it.

[400exRacerX]

Some kid on the board called "rollaxis400ex" has two 425ex's with lobo II front ends. I would just pm him and ask him. Personaly I would just get the houser long travel a arms with elka shocks.

[T-R-X]

Lobo's nice, but you can always check out the gibson!

[Foxrage]

The houser elka is just as good setup. I think a guy is offering the houser long travel with elka long travel for around 1450.

[RollAxis400ex]

i have the LOBO II and i love it it jumps nice takes whoops great and coners like no other it is worth the money cause i always feel u get what u pay for

I have lobo II front end and back end. I race motocross every weekend you can't beat it.

[Nausty]

wow that quad is nice;)

[Dave400ex]

The Lobo is the Second Best Setup you can Buy. If you want the Best, get Walsh. That Stuff is a Piece of Art. The Laeger T-Pin is the Third Best, but Laeger does not make a T-Pin for the 400ex. Then I would say the Houser/Elka Setup, and then Gibson. Those are some Nice Roll Design 400EX`s.

[MOOCAZEN]

YOU GUYS HAVE TO WAIT, OR DID SOMEONE HAVE THEM ALREADY, I MEAN THE LOBOS, I WANT W FRONT END, BUT I DONT WANT TO WAIT

[Foxrage]

No T-pin is deff first then roll then walsh and houser. For the price though i would say houser all the way.

[RollAxis400ex]

one of my lobos took 6 weeks to get and one of them took 6 months to get it was worth it tho

[Dave400ex]

NACS400EX, The Walsh is the Best Setup you can Buy. Doug Gust and Dave Diver said the Walsh was the Best, Roll Design was Second, and the Laeger T-Pin was Third. Go with Walsh if you have the Money.

MOOCAZEN, At one Time I heard there was a Six Month Wait on Roll. I`m not sure if that is still True or Not. Call Duncan, K&K, or East Coast ATV and see what they Say.

You'd think with Doug Roll raping people on his products that he'd at least be able to hire a person or 2 to keep up with demand,,,he does make some sick products,,but 700% mark-up on all products is not fair to the consumer I don't think..

[400exRacerX]

Walsh racecraft chassis products are the best money can buy period. They are hand made and will last forever. You may pay alittle more and wait longer but it is well worth it. I don't care about what you all say the best chassis components are because it is walsh.

[Dave400ex]

Rico, Doug Roll is not the only Person that Charges a lot for A-Arms and Swingarms. All of the Guys do. It does not take anywhere close to $550 to make A-Arms. Roll just thinks because he is Selling Axis Shocks with it he can Charge even more and People won`t Notice. I would never Pay $2500 for a Lobo. I would like to have one though.

Thank You 400exRacerX. Walsh is the Best you can Buy.

[400exRacerX]

Yeah, I would never pay 2,500 for a lobo front end, Doug Roll is out of his mind. I rather just ride my +2 houser a arms with works shocks.:p

[RollAxis400ex]

u guys have to ride a 400ex with a lobo front and rear to see why there so much money works with +2 doesnt compare

[Dave400ex]

I know Houser +2 A-Arms with Works Shocks wouldn`t Compare to a Lobo Front End, but that has nothing to do with how much Doug Charges. I don`t care if the Lobo is the Best. Axis Shocks are around $1300. Nobody can tell me those A-Arms are Worth $1200. That`s Nuts.

[RollAxis400ex]

there worth it when ur winning at the track every week

OH I garauntee it's a one of kind ride,,,,my problem is with MOST,,not all,, But Most aftermarket companies,,are raping us guys on their products,,,there's no way that with time and material they have to have that much cash to pay overhead.

The point is,,,ATV racing of any kind will never,,ever reach it's high point,,with companies that market their products for their benefit and not the benefit of us,,the costumer. These companies are part of the reason we don't get the respect we deserve.. Heck John Arens will say the same thing,,for those of you that want to argue this post,,go search ATV scene I think it is,,when they had a big write up on were ATV racing is goin,,,,,,all the racers (pro's), engine builders, chassis makers, etc,,,all said the same thing I'm sayin,,,were getting screwed and with a high price market on ATV racing,,it's goin nowear quick.

[Dave400ex]

Rico Hit the Nail on the Head with that Post. Nuff Said. I agree. All of the Aftermarket Companies are Charging way to Much. The only thing that should Cost more is the Shocks. They are the Hardest Part to make.

If I bought another bike I would drop $3800 for full roll and axis again. It is well worth the wait!!!!!!!!!!

[400exRacerX]

If I bought another bike I would drop a duce! LOL

[Dave400ex]

Was the $3800 for the Front and Rear End?

[Tommy 17]

thats alot of money for the average weekend warrior racer like me... personaly when i have the money if ever i will be gettin houser +2 with elka front piggy backs ssd and a rear conversion to ssd... i will never need anythin more then that and it will last me forever!!!

i hear roll designs are supose to start coming with elka shocks. hopefully that drops the price some. i am gonna save up by next winter and hopfully get all aftermarket chassis and chassis components.i think elkas gonna be robbing alot of peps customers.

[T-R-X]

Isnt roll design currently with axis? Why are the changing their shock distrubiter?

i'm not sure of this yet..but it's what i heard..i guess the only thing axis are really good at is cross country. i hear they are still to soft for motocross

[Dave400ex]

LRD, What Brand of Chassis Parts are you going to Buy, and for what Quad?

I also heard the thing about Elka and Roll Design. I asked Jeff, and he said he couldn`t say anything yet. That means something is going to Happen. I hope it does Drop the Lobo`s Prices some. They are Crazy now.

it depends on what i can afford but if i get this job i want it will be a roll design quad all the way.. that why i'll be saving all year if you know what i mean.

[Dave400ex]

That would be Sweet. An all out Roll Design 250r.

yeah..but i got a 416ex..but i will have another 250r after i finish the 416

[Foxrage]

I dont think walsh is better if you look at the t pin out of pros and walsh they pic t pin and so would i walsh isnt all that great. But I would go with the houser just cause it is just as good as all of the others for the price you have to pay for it.

[Dave400ex]

LRD, Roll Design doesn`t make a Frame for the 400EX do they? That`s why I figured it would be a 250r. It`s going to be Sweet no matter what Quad it is.

NACS, I know most of the Pro`s run Laeger, that`s why I like Laeger, but Doug Gust even said Walsh is Better. He ran a T-Pin before Walsh so he would know. I would rather have a T-Pin then Walsh, but I was just saying Walsh is the Best you are going to get. The Houser Setup is very Good. I would like to have one.

[DEAL]

I don't see what the big deal is with axis shocks, I think they are way over-rated , elkas are just as good and slightly cheaper. And really not alot of pros run axis anyways , most of them i see running pep.

[400exRacerX]

Heres my buds full roll design 250r, its roll design everything. Frame, Subframe, swingarm, a arms, steering stem, handlebar clamp, and axis shocks all around. Its roughly a 12,000 dollar chassis.

[Foxrage]

ok ya then i guess it could be better i think most peopl would prefer the t pin though i know i would i think the walsh dont look like any more travel than regular housers.

[Dave400ex]

I think Axis Shocks are over Priced and talked about to Much. Elka is just as Good and PEP is used more at the Track then Axis. I don`t know what the Deal is.

That 250r looks Fast just Sitting there.

NACS, There is something about Walsh that makes him the Best. I`m not sure what, but I don`t think I will argue with Doug Gust. Really the Walsh A-Arms don`t look like they have much Travel.

[mrusk]

Walsh is the best you can get. If you havnt realized more and more pros are going to walsh. All of the top 4 stroke pro am and 4 stroke a guys are running walsh. You can get any better than walsh. I have seen his frame, it is a work of art.

matt

[beerock]

just to ad my .02 cents.

the tpins are great but they are used to eliminate bump steer. both the roll and the walsh dont need t-pins because of there design, which makes them both better.

I do luv the laeger pro trax though, I felt I was going slow on the laeger at the same speed as on my bike.

you gotta hand it to both walsh and roll, neither of them have t pins and they have 0 bump steer!

I think the roll and walsh would come down to preference.



HEy 400ex racer thats rich bucks bike.

I was there last week.
that bike is sick.

do you work at honda or something?

[mrusk]

Beerock sorry to disagree with you but the roll has alot of bumpsteer. The gibson are the only aarms i have heard of that have zero bumpsteer.

Matt

[400exRacerX]

Where were you at last week? What day?

warrior..i dunno but i thought roll made a 400ex frame but i might be wrong. if not i will buy a aftermarket one ..anything but lonestar junk..i want a nice quad..just need a job

[Pro400EXC]

HEY GUYS, I WAS WONDER,DOES WALSH MAKE XC A-ARMS?IF NOT,I WONDER IF HE CAN CUSTOM MAKE ME SOME, THOSE ARMS OF HIS, ARE ART WORK,JUST LOOK AT THEM,THEY ARE TIGHT WORK YO,HEHE

[beerock]

it was more like a month ago.....400exracer.

mrusk have you ridden a roll?

I havent so I dont know, but I have heard from people who have them (like rich buck) and theres no bump steer.

my point before that neither the walsh nor the roll need t pins to get rid of bump steer. the engineering of the frames and/or a-arms takes the bump steer out. so theres no need for tpins, which wear out really fast.

[Dave400ex]

Walsh and Roll Design by Far are the Best. They don`t need a T-Pin to reduce the Bump Steer. Their A-Arms are Built to take it out. I would much rather have Walsh A-Arms then a Laeger T-Pin, because I have heard the T-Pin`s are a lot of Work.

LRD, I don`t know if Roll makes a Frame or not. You will have to Call Duncan and ask. I thought he just made 250r Frames.

Pro400EXC, Go to WWW.EastCoastATV.COM and check out Walsh. I think Walsh could get you a Nice XC Setup.

[Pro400EXC]

Hey Guys, I was wondering If I could maybe get some +1 XC a-arms from Walsh, then for XC racing,I will run rims with a 1:4 off-set rims, and if I wanna do some MX play riding,I will run a 3:2 off-set maybe?Hows that sound?

Do you think If I had +2 arms and a wider axle and shock,that would help reduce my fear of Bustin Big Air? Thks

[Honda Guy]

rollaxis400ex are those 19" shocks?
and what who groved those front tires you have do they hook up really well or do the skate alot?

[Dave400ex]

Pro400EXC, That sounds like a Good Idea. You need to get New Shocks though too. As for the +2 A-Arms, Wider Axle, and Shocks, I don`t think you would be Afraid to Bust Big Air with them as you would with another Setup. You have to Figure out what you Want, a XC Setup, or MX Setup. They are Two different Things.

[mrusk]

When you try to use the same setup for both mx and xc you never get the full potential outta the setup. But if you insist on it be sure to get compression and rebound adj shocks so you can fine tune them for what kind of racing you are doing.

matt

[RollAxis400ex]

yea there 19'' shocks and the tires were groved by east coast atv

[QuadRacer041]

rollaxis, do you have any pics of the back of your quad?
i was at deans on sunday and saw the bikes there and all i think they had were roll front ends not rear ends. do you have any pics of the back side of your bike.
and you never anwsered about were you race. what tracks do you race at.

also my freind has a complete roll R and that thing has NO bump steer at all. it out handles anything ive ever ridin before.

[Foxrage]

That thing is sweet!! I Would like to have that setup but i dont even have 8900 for th frame if i did it would take forever to buy the motor and stuff to go in it.

[Dave400ex]

Mrusk is 100% Right.

RollAxis, I would also like to see a Picture of the Rear End. What Kind of Axle, Axle Carrier, Lock Nut, and Hubs are you Running? It is Sweet.

That is a very Nice Roll Design 250r. I would like to have a Complete Roll Design Setup. A Setup like that would be Sweet with a CRF450 Motor. I think I would rather have Walsh though. Heck, I would take anything for Free.

[mrusk]

I have seen that lobo in person, it is very nice. It is the guy that i got my R from. Hes Racer101 on here. In one of his post he said that the Lobo wasnt worth the money and that your better off getting a arens frame with lobo front and rear end.

I am thinking about getting a arens frame with walsh everything else when i get a frame. Who knows, it all depends on how much $ i have when the time comes.

matt

[Dave400ex]

Mrusk, That is Racer101? I remember him saying that about the Lobo. He did say to Buy a Arens Frame and Lobo Front and Rear End. I would just go all Walsh instead.

An Arens Frame with all Walsh would be Sweet. You could also just go all Walsh. All of that Stuff will Cost some Money.

[RollAxis400ex]

quad041 i dont have any rear pics of my 400ex
WarriorMan i have an RPM dominator axle, RPM anti fade nut and east coast atv carrier and stock 400ex hubs

[RollAxis400ex]

here is a newer pic of my quad

[Dave400ex]

Man you got the Best of Everything. What kind of Pipe you Running?

[RollAxis400ex]

Tc racing

[Dave400ex]

That`s what I got. How do you like it? I want to Call Tom and ask about a XC Motor Setup.

[RollAxis400ex]

i love the pipe my brother is getting the curtis sparks this week so we are going to see which one is better either way i like the tc's power and sound

[mrusk]

Rollaxis i get my motor back from dean on saturday. I cant freakin wait man!

matt

[RollAxis400ex]

another pic

[James70214]

I thought you had the lobo rear end?

[Foxrage]

Are you going to get the lobo rear end?? I think some fullbore plastic or a carbon fiber hoof would make it look sweet.

[RollAxis400ex]

nah i dont have the rear lobo
i stoped doing **** to this quad cause i am getting rid of it this year

[Adam496]

RollAxis400ex,
if ur going to sell it i may buy it since im in nj too. well any way what is that bar that is connected to ur motor mount

[Dave400ex]

RollAxis, You will have to let me know on the Sparks and TC Pipe.

Why are you getting Rid of it? What are you going to Get?

[RollAxis400ex]

the bar on the motor mount is a streering damper
i and selling to like a walsh/axis yzf426

[Dave400ex]

Wow. A Walsh/Axis/YZ426? That is going to be a Killer. Have you thought about a CRF450?

[Adam496]

so around how much r u going to be selling this quad

[RollAxis400ex]

i dont no yet but i will let no when i no

[Adam496]

ok im really interested. well i hope ur 426 quad is sweet

[Dave400ex]

I`m guessing it will be a very Big Number.

[400MXer]

RollAxis400ex - NICE quad.....i likes.

And your building a yz426 quad....dang...i would love to have one of those....they rip...i want to ride one, but i don't know anyone that has one.

Yeah....have you thought about the CR450motor?

[Dave400ex]

400MXer, How are your A-Arms, Shocks, and Motor Coming? Do you have any of them Yet?

I would say RollAxis has some Money.

[mrusk]

RollAxis- The fastway motor isnt fast enuff for you??!? lol

matt

[RollAxis400ex]

o believe me the fastway motor rips it is real fast it takes banshee, raptors, other 400exs, and even a lot of 250rs but when i am racing yzf426s and crf450s i cant keep up

[mrusk]

I hope my fastway R motor rippps! Picking it up tommror hopefully!!!!!

matt

[Dave400ex]

RollAxis, Are you going to do a YZ426 or a CRF450? I think the 450 is better.

[RollAxis400ex]

i am going to ride both and see what i like

[Dave400ex]

Wow, You can Ride Both? I wish I could Ride one, more less Own it.

[RollAxis400ex]

i have friends that have them so they let me ride them i have rode a yzf440 i still havent rode the crf450 yet

[Dave400ex]

Man there must be some Rich Guys where you live. There is no Quads like that around here. My Brother`s is one of the Nicest. Let us know when you Ride a CRF450. Those things are Sweet.

[RollAxis400ex]

we have some really nice quads here lots of yzf, crf, and full lobo, leager and walsh quads some of the best u can buy and everyone has a lobo front end on there 400exs its nothing special anymore like it was 2 years ago

[Dave400ex]

RollAxis, I wish my Town had Guys with Quads like that. It is just all Dreams of a Lobo. I guess you Guys don`t think it is a Big Deal anymore. Do you have any Pictures of other Quads?

[RollAxis400ex]

nah i dont really have pics of other peoples quads maybe one day we will line up all are quads and take a big pic of all of them

[Dave400ex]

That would be Sweet. How does the Walsh, Lobo, and Laeger T-Pin Front Ends compare?

[RollAxis400ex]

walsh and lobo are really the same and i like them the best

[trx400ex]

so the lobo units are worth the extra money over standard geometry plus 3s with axis shocks?

[MOOCAZEN]

I MIGHT BE TRADING A GUY FOR MY STUFF AND CASH FOR HIS LOBO FRONT, EVERYONE CROSS THERE FINGERS AND PRAY FOR ME!!!!!:D

[Dave400ex]

I like Walsh the Best. He makes everything by Hand. You have to Wait a while and Pay a lot for Walsh though.

[QuadRacer041]

boy rollaxis i wanna be like you.
i only have a lonestar 400ex and a lonestar 250r, i know they dont compare to your great roll bike.
once angain it seems funny though, that you ride all these differnt bikes, race all these differnt places, yet no pics of you in action.youd think that if you ride with all these fancy bikes one of you guys would bring a camera to the track or wherever you ride.
also, it seems when ever i ask you a question about the tracks you race at, NO anwser,but if some compliments you on how nice your bike is or about how great you think it handles, you are real quick to respond.
hmmmmmmmmmmm

[MOOCAZEN]

EXACTLY WHAT I WAS GOING TO SAY

[RollAxis400ex]

if you think i am lieing about my quads thats great cause ur wrong, if u look on the bottom of all my post it says dist 6 and dist 2 that means that i race at all the dist 2 adn 6 tracks like flying dutchman, sleepy hollow, atco then other tracks are high point, budds creek, chatsworth, englishtown, and i will go to a few walden races this year

[MOOCAZEN]

TELL HIM

[QuadRacer041]

and why do you keep saying you have a roll400ex, all you have is roll a arms, not a whole roll chassis

[RollAxis400ex]

just cause u say roll 400ex doesnt meean u have a roll frame and plus roll doesnt even make 400ex frames
and what tracks do u ride at

[QuadRacer041]

ouch, looks like i hit a nerve.
well thats the way you make it sound, usually when poeple say they have a laeger bike or lonestar bike it means its the complete chassis or more then just one brand of that part.
i never said roll made a 400ex chassis, and never said i raced, im looking to do some races this season and wanted to know what tracks you raced at.
like i said i specifically ask what tracks there were within your district.
id love to see you up at walden cause thats were ill being doing some races up there.

[QuadRacer041]

can you do this on your ROLL bike,im doing this a lame old lonestar swing arm and a arms, with pep shocks.

[400MXer]

WarriorMan i got my a arms....they are nice...very strong and well built....but i got about another week for my shocks.....as for my motor...well who knows...i've got the cylinder and valve cap, but no carb, head, piston, cam ect. Hopefully soon.



I race but i don't have any pics of me racing. To some people, it's just not that important. So since i have no pics, does that mean that i'm lying? Some people on this site just look for reason's to accuse other's of lying. So what if he is lying, he's giving us something to talk about!

[QuadRacer041]

no that doesnt mean your lying, and im not saying he's lying.
but when you talk all this $hit about having this and having that, riding this and riding that, saying you can beat this and beat that, well id like to see some proof, he comes off to me like he's some kind of expert just by the way he talks and i just find it a little starnge that,wow all this talk but hmmm no pics.
its just real easy to make up storys here because theres not a really big chance that youd actually ever meet these people.
but we'll see maybe he can make it to the raush creek ride, if not o well, i guess ill never really know for sure huh?

[Adam496]

hey rollaxis,
if ur going to walden a few times mayby ill see u there
this is my first year racing a 125 so ill be #496 in the 125c class
what class r u in because quad a is killer u might have some competion

I have a full Roll Design Chassis and I love it. I also have a Arens Chassis with the Lobo II front end on it. I must say it worth all the money. I have NO BUMP STEER. I have seen quads like Racer #102 that have the in correct off set front rims up front, this will produce the un wanted bump steer. I run NO stearing dampiner. There is no need it all. A plus two set up is fine. But it is a night and day compaired to a long travel front end set up, If it a roll, walsh, houser or K-mart. The two are so different. I am not knocking eather front ent bolth are great if set up correctly.

[Dave400ex]

400MXer, Do you have any Pictures of the A-Arms? I want to see how the Black and Chrome Looks. I hope them Shocks come soon. I can`t believe you still don`t have your Motor. How come you only have some Parts? Didn`t Bud send the whole Motor back?

Quad041, I don`t think there is any Reason to Flame this Guy. He has not done anything to any of us. He has Pictures to show his Quad, so why would he be afraid to Post Pictures of him Racing? I don`t think he has anything to Prove to Us.

Racer101, Do you have any Pictures of those Quads? They sound very Nice. How do you think the Walsh and Roll Compare?

[mrusk]

Racer101- What is the difference between the arens frame and the full roll?

And i heard that you were down at Deans last week and was impressed with the inside of my motor!heh
I get it back monday or tuesday.

matt

[Dave400ex]

I would also like some Info on the Arens Setup.

[Pro400EXC]

Yah,hey Guys,I finally over came my Fear of Busting Big Air,by riding a friends MX400ex,and lemme tell you,I am hudge MotoX fan now.

I raced a few races,sold my 400ex,and my Pick-Up(bought a cheap lil S-10 now) and I had this Custom Made CRF450R Walsh qyuad built,I am serious racer now,I love it,It handles like F1 car and has gobs of 250r eatin power.

It cost me $23k all together, I will race the White Bros 4-stroke nationals,and I will aslo race Red Bud,and some of my local MX races,I prolly have the trickest quad,in the state of florida now,**** in the back oof my S-10,it looks sweet,it makes my S-10 looklike a Caddy.haha,see I can joke around too!!

[RollAxis400ex]

yea i like gill attixs quad from east coast atv too

[Dave400ex]

As Good as that Looks, it would Look a lot Better in my Garage. That is one Sweet Quad. I really like the Walsh Stuff.

Pro400EXC, Are you still going to get some A-Arms, Shocks, and Stuff?

[400MXer]

WarriorMan-------i took some pics of just the a arms...and i'm waiting for my shocks so i can take pics of them on the quad....then i'll get the film developed and show ya. I wish i had a digital camera...would make things a lot easier.

[Dave400ex]

Thanks 400MXer. Your 416 is Awesome. I can`t Wait to see the A-Arms and Shocks. I want a Digital Camera too.

[400MXer]

Racer101 - isn't the proper offset for those a arms 4+1.

RollAxis400ex - what offset rims do you have...are those 3+2 with beadlocks....because i was wondering if they made 3+2 with beadlocks...i really want some...ONCE i make some money that it...i'm poor now...i spent about $3g's on my quad this winter.

[Dave400ex]

400MXer, Are you still going to Mow Yards? I need Summer to Come so I can make some Money too.

[RollAxis400ex]

there +3+2 beadlocks, i have +4+1 rolled edges at home but my tire has came off the rim to many times not to use beadlocks all around. to anyone that thinks beadlocks are a waste take it from me that ur front and rear tires can come off and it sucks

[Dave400ex]

RollAxis, You have had Tires come off the Bead while MX Racing? I would think that is a Big Problem in XC Racing then. I want some Carbon Fiber Beadlocks.

[RollAxis400ex]

yea before i had beadlocks i had a front and a rear tire come off the bead

[Dave400ex]

Now that would Suck if it was in the Middle of a Race.

[400MXer]

YUP STILL MOWING GRASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!
I need this damn snow to melt and the sun to come out and grass to grow so i can make some money.

Sweet--I wanted some front beadlocks but i didn't want 4+1, i wanted the 3+2.....thanx

[Dave400ex]

I am Mowing a Few Yards too. The Drain Tile Guy said he didn`t need any Help right now, but if he does he said he would Call. I hope he does. I need that Money.

Are going to get some Front Beadlocks Now?

[400MXer]

Yeah....my friends dad has never called so i commited to my boss and told him that i was deffinetly mowing this summer.


I've always wanted some front beadlocks....but if i get some...it won't be for a while. I've got some front rims that do fine right now.....so untill i have the spare money, i'm gonna concentrate(SP) on the parts i need, such as swingarm, carb, stuff like that.

[Dave400ex]

I don`t really Care what my Job is, I just want to get one this Summer.

Yeah since you already have Douglas Front Rims I would get other stuff before Front Beadlocks. They would be Nice to have though.

[400MXer]

Yup exactly what i was thinking....i've got rear beadlocks but my fronts are .190's. and you figure, beadlocks are about 120 a piece, so that's 240, i can buy a lot of things with $240.

RollAxis400ex - you have a laeger swingarm right? how long did you wait to get it...and when did you get it. Also, how's the chrome holding up?

[RollAxis400ex]

i got it right away they had it in stock it was last year and the chrome sucks it is coming off on the whole right side. i would never get any thing chrome again it starts to look bad and chrome is weaker

[400MXer]

oh....the chrome is that bad huh? i guess that's not what i want then....i want a black one! Thanx

[Foxrage]

Chrome isnt very good for rough riding unless you have the money to get it redone each season. It does looks better but after aging it looks worst than regular powdercoating.

[Dave400ex]

400MXer, You can Buy a lot of Stuff with $240. You could get all your Carbon Stuff. I wouldn`t get a Chrome Swingarm. I would go with the Black. It would match the A-Arms. You could have your Frame Powdercoated Black and have your SubFrame Chromed. That would look Sweet. The only Stuff I would Chrome is your Top A-Arms, Steering Stem, and SubFrame. All the rest could be Black. I think that would look Awesome like that.

[Foxrage]

ya your 400 will look sweet like the way warrior man said.

[Dave400ex]

NACS, I saw your going with a Sparks Pipe now? What happened? I like the Setup you have in your Signature. It`s the one I said.

What Color of Plastic would look Good with all that Black Stuff?

that kid changes his mind 10 times a week

[Foxrage]

No its 20 times a week. Its hard to get the right thing when there is so much i dont have and want. I just want sparks because after i get stock pipe cerimic coated and the head sheild chromed to make it look as good as the curtis sparks. Plus the price of the tc will cost as much as the sparks so im just going to get the sparks.

[Foxrage]

I think silver plastic with nacs graphics would look sweet with black frame and everything.

[Dave400ex]

You will be Happy with the Sparks. My 400EX is getting a Tune Up right Now. I have to get it Today.

I was thinking the Silver Plastic and Nac`s Graphics too. I tried to get a Picture of the Silver on the Maier Site, but there is none. That would be Cool though.

[MOOCAZEN]

IM GETTING THE 250 MAIER BLACK PLASTICS, MY BUDDY GAVE ME HIS DUNCAN STICKER KIT AND SEAT COVER WITH THE SEAT, SO ILL HAVE TO SETUPS, NOW LET ME KNOW GUYS BAT THIS OTHER SITUATION, THERES A GUY THAT WANTS TO TRADE ME MY +2 LONG TRAVEL HOUSER A-ARMS AND DUAL AXIS DUAL ADJUSTABLE AND SOME CASH, FOR HIS CHROME +3 LOBO A-ARMS AND TRIPLE RATE DUAL ADJUSTABLE AXIS, WHAT SHOULD I DO, MINE IS 6 HRS OLD AND HIS IS 6 MNTHS OLD, LET ME KNOW ASAP

[MOOCAZEN]

AND I GOT FINALLY MY FATBOY EXHAUST, ILL BE POSTING UP A SITE OF OUR NEW TEAM, LOKOTES RACING, WAIT TILL YOU CHECK OUT THE BIKES ON THAT SITE

[Dave400ex]

MOOCAZEN, You have one of the Sweetest 400EX`s I have seen. Do you have any Pictures of the Lobo? I would really check it out before you Buy it. I think it would be better then the Houser. You should Call on Walsh stuff. It is even better then Roll Design. I think it`s Cheaper too. Have you ridden with the Fatboy? How much did it add? I like Duncan. They make good Stuff.

[MOOCAZEN]

the guy overnight shipped me the pics, wait till i get pics finally of my bike, man i hate not having a digi camera, yeah i know, i dont want to just go off and trade wihtout knowing how they look, i hope they look good, i nwouldnt have to wait to buy that again, they are already setup also for me, so I'm stoked.we'll see what happens, but no, i haven't rode with the Fatboy yet, i was riding with the stock exhaust,the only thing i liked was the fact that it brought the noise level down.

[Dave400ex]

I can`t tell you to Buy it or Not if I can`t look at it. If it`s in Good Shape, I would go for it. It sounds like you have a good Deal here. I mean, how often do you Find a Used Lobo Front End already Setup for you? Go for it. Let us know how that Pipe works.

[MOOCAZEN]

i will

[Dave400ex]

OK, Thanks.

[mrusk]

Hey guys i got my motor back from Fastway last night! ITs FUGGGIN AWESOME LOOKING! I cant wait to try it out.

Guess whos bike was down there? Rollaxis 400. Guys i will tell you this, the bike looked alot better in the pics!!!

matt

[Dave400ex]

You haven`t Rode with the New Motor? You will like it if it`s anything like my Brothers.

His 400 was there? How did it Look?

[mrusk]

No i havnt rode my motor yet, Just got it back after the guy had it for 2 weeks. I cant wait to ride it, tho it will proably be another 3 weeks.

Rollaxis bike must of had some frame crackage cuz there was metal welded to it all over. The bike does have some nice parts on it and proably looked really nice when it was put together but it aint mint anymore.

matt

[Dave400ex]

It only took 2 Weeks? Man you are Lucky. My Brother`s was like 6 Months.

Frame Cracks? Now that would Suck. He should have Gusseted it Early so it wouldn`t look like Crap. That`s why I want to do mine. I might just Buy another Stock Frame and send it out to be Gusseted and Powdercoated.

[Foxrage]

Moocazen i would keep the houser and buy other stuff with the extra cash. Someone that has both said the houser is just as goo but if you want to go all out get the walsh like warriorman said they are sweet. I would like to have the walsh cannondale.

[MOOCAZEN]

is that the lobo is +3 minw is +2, iw ant +3, i already have everything i want, the engine, well im just going to buy a whole separate one, no more hassle, i heard with modifications, you can throw a 250r engine in there, i will see what to do

[mrusk]

MO-Get the lobo or buy the 19IN HOUSER aarms and the 19in axis. Or you may want to concided walsh i heard the wait for his aarms wasnt' all that long.

matt

[RollAxis400ex]

hey now u can tell quad041 i am not a lier. dean put the metal plate just by the shock tower to make sure that it doesnt crack. there is not breaks in the frame yet tho those pics were taken last weak i didnt have time to clean it before i brought it over to deans

[Dave400ex]

You know What, there is a Easy way to do this. Since you want Roll Design and you have Houser, you should just get Walsh that is better then Both.

[400MXer]

WarriorMan- Silver plastic was exactly what i was thinking....i have been emailing Fullbore to see if they make or will make silver plastic. I won't have enough money for that untill the end of this summer. Also, my motor is almost here....i guess bud sold my cam to someone else, and he's waiting to get another shipment of them to get to me.....and my shocks will be here by this weekend.

[mrusk]

RollAxis- Dean told me your motor is abeast and hauls ***!

What is he doing to your bike now?

matt

[Dave400ex]

By the End of this Week you will have a Awesome 400EX. I can`t Wait to see it all Together.

[RollAxis400ex]

the head bolts pulled out from all the comp so he is heli coil all the bolts i am going to pick it up tonight the motor is so fast

[Foxrage]

moocazenhow about you get me some pics of your front end and ill try to buy it.

[mrusk]

Yea man Dean is a great guy and knows his schit! Hes the only motor guy i am gonna use! I cant wait to kick my motor over for the first time!

matt

[RollAxis400ex]

were are u going to ride it yea deans a great guy and he really nos what he is talking about

[400MXer]

Hopefully i will have it all together by the end of the week....if Bud fischer wouldn't have sold my cam to someone else, i would be able to ride my quad, and train....i haven't got to ride in a long time. I'm gonna be out of shape during the first race now because i haven't gotten any ride time.

[Dave400ex]

You better get Lifting Weights MXer. Are you still going to Red Bud?

[mrusk]

Rollaxis- I wont be riding if for liek 3 weeks, i still have to wait for shocks, aarms, and some other stuff.

I can not imagine what it is going to be like!!!

matt

[RollAxis400ex]

if there is any nj riders out there i think i am going to atco raceway tomorrow so check it out its always fun having more quad riders

[400MXer]

I do lift weights...i always lift wieghts...and i run. but i usually ride like 3 or 4 times a week too...but i haven't been able to.

[Dave400ex]

You are doing all you Can.

This is Nuts. My Dad said something about getting the Complete Roll Design Frame Setup for my Brother`s 250r. Now that would be Sweet.

[400MXer]

A complete rolll setup.....does he usually talk like that....maybe he better have a talk with my dad...maybe mine will buy me a roll 250r. lol....i've payed for everything....and it's money well spent. but my dad did help me out when i bought it...but i've payed him back every penny.

[trx400ex]

that would be awesome if he got that roll setup, heck even just the front and rearends would be sweet....what do you think the wait is on that....i know the swingarms are 8 months

[Dave400ex]

My Dad is Crazy. He wants to Win. I don`t think we will get the Roll Setup, he just said that. The Wait is 8 Months to a Year on that Stuff. I`m not sure what kind of Frame he wants. Laeger is backed up too. Even Arens has a Wait. Who knows.

[400MXer]

Guess what....Fullbore has some silver plastic in stock right now...they wrote me an email and said that every now and then they make a limited supply of a diff. color..and right now they have silver. the only prob is...i don't have any money. i hope they make some more next winter....when i'm ready to buy.

[Foxrage]

I just talked to my mom and told her how much 4 wheelers mean to me and she said if i get a job this summer she said she will pay for half of a full walsh elka setup. Man i hope i can get enough the frame is like 3000 its self plus 1000 in shocks and another 2000 or so in a-arms swing arm and stem.

[Dave400ex]

400MXer, You should Email them back and ask if they will make more next Winter.

NACS, Your Mom is Cool. I Emailed East Coast ATV and Walsh does not make a Frame for the 400EX. I don`t know if he will make a Custom Frame or Not. If he will, you better Order the Frame Now. There is about a Year Wait on it.

[mrusk]

Nacs you dont need a full Walsh setup! Come on get real. If you want to get Walsh stuff get his aarms, swingarm, and sterring stem.

The wait on a Walsh frame is 16months and yes he will make custom frames.

matt

[trx400ex]

hahahaha...man, youve never even raced and you want to go for a full walsh setup..geez....what if you race once and dont like it? if i wanted to spend too much on the chassis i would go for the lobo units, but i dont , so ill probably by laeger stuff for my shee, i already made mistakes on getting stuff for my 400, so now i make all my desicions right the first time....id wait till the stock frame goes before buying an aftermarket one, but you can buy 5 stock frame for the price of one aftermarket....and for a walsh 6

[Foxrage]

GEEEEZZZ guys i was just FUC%in with you guys. My mom wouldnt do that if i even had the money she is a *****. I am planning on getting th a-arms and elkas though. For real.

[Dave400ex]

If NACS wants a Walsh Frame, let him get one. That would be a Sweet Setup. I would just Send your Stock Frame out and have it Gusseted and Powdercoated. I think Walsh makes a 400EX SubFrame. You could get a Walsh SubFrame, A-Arms, Steering Stem, and Swingarm. Then you would need a RPM Axle Carrier, Axle, Anti-Fade Nut, and Front and Rear Hubs. Then get some PEP ZPS Shocks Front and Rear and I would say that is a Nice 400EX. Well, it would need a better Motor too. Time to Call TC. Get a 416 or 440 National Motor.

[trx400ex]

in that case my mom is buying me all the top 10 pros quads and they are teaching me how to ride them

[Dave400ex]

You need Taught how to Ride them? One Word of Advice, Hang On.

Are you still going to the Badlands on Saturday?

[Foxrage]

I plan on getting all those walsh things but lonestar everything and nacs front hubs. I dont want to spend 400 on an axle when i could actually spend 290 on a duabend and not have to worry but im getting lonestar for extra security.

[Dave400ex]

You can get a RPM for $370. I bet the LSR will be OK for You.

[Foxrage]

Ya i only way 110 right now and i figure the most ill way for a while is 130 or 140.

[Dave400ex]

110? Your in what Grade? Man that is Small. LOL. The Lonestar will be Fine.

[Foxrage]

9th grade. I think lonestar will be fine.

[Dave400ex]

Yeah the Lonestar will be Fine.

[MOOCAZEN]

ILL BE GETTING THE LOBO FRONT FROM THAT DEAL I SAID, I SHOULD GET IT BY FRIDAY, CHROME LOBO A-ARMS AND 19 INCH TRIPLE RATE DUAL ADJ AXIS SHOCKS, FINALLY, ILL POST PICKS AS SOON AS THE COMPLETE MAKE OVER IS DONE

[Dave400ex]

Sweet. Don`t you have to Pay the Guy a little Extra Money?

[MOOCAZEN]

BUT THATS FNE WITH ME

[Dave400ex]

Are the Shocks already Setup for your Weight? Now you need a Lobo Rear End.

[MOOCAZEN]

ID ENTICAL TO WHAT IM SENDING HIM 200 LB PRO AM MX

[Dave400ex]

You got a Good Deal. What are you going to Buy Now?

[MOOCAZEN]

DO YOU MEAN:confused:

[Dave400ex]

What are you going to Buy? A Lobo Rear End, Duncan 440?

[MOOCAZEN]

WELL IM LOOKING INTO A GPR STABILIZER, MY REAR IS FINE RIGHT NOW, I HAD GOTTEN THE REAR SHOCK REVAVLED , THATS FINE, AND I LIKE THE LENGTH OF MY SWINGARM, SO I WONT CHANGE THAT UNTIL I BREAK IT, AS FOR THE 440, IM EITHER LOOKING INTO GETTING A 250R ENGINE OR A SEPARATE 440 ENGINE, COMPLETE AND JUST SWITCH THEM IN CASE SOMETHING HAPPENS, I HEARD THERES A ADAPTER KIT TO PLACE A 250R ENGINE IN THE FRAME, ILL BE GUSSTEEING THE FRAME AND PODWERCOATING AT THE END OR MIDDLE OF SUMMER, NOT TO MANY PEOPLE HAVE WORK DURING THAT TIME AND CHROMING THE SUB FRAME, I DONT KNOW YET, IM LOOKING INTO GETTING THOSE WORKS CONNECTION FRAME GAURDS, NOT AS BEEFY AS THE DG'S BUT IT PROVIDES PROTECTION, I ALREADY RUBBED ALL THE PAINT OFF MY FRAME FROM WEAR, SO I DONT KNOW WHAT ELSE TO DO:confused:

[trx400ex]

hey, let us know how much better the roll front end is than your old setup, and the ups and downs, ok? i wish i could find someone selling a used banshee lobo front end for cheap

[Dave400ex]

Sounds good Moocazen. Why don`t you just Buy a 250r though? You could Hop it all Up. What Color are you going to Powdercoat your Frame? Rather then that I think you got everything. Let us know how the Setups Compare.

TRX400EX, I don`t think you will Find One. After Spending that much Money I don`t know why somebody would want to Sell it. Are you still going to the Badlands?

[MOOCAZEN]

IM GETTING MARRIED SOON AND THE COOL THING IS MY CHICK HAS A MINT STOCK 88 250R, I CANT MODIFY IT YET CAUSE SHE'LL GET MAD AND HER POPS A JERK, BUT ONCE I GET MARRIED SHE BE BRINGING THAT ALONG, I WANT TO POWDER COAT THE BIKE MATTE BLACK, LOWER A-ARMS MATTE BLACK, SWING ARM MATTE BLACK AND SUBFRAME AND UPPER A-ARMS CHROME, ILL START TO FIX UP HER BIKE, I HAVE LOT OF BUDDIED THAT CONSTANTLY CHANGE THERE 250RS, MY BUDDY JUST CHANGED HIS PROTRAX 250R'S PLASTICS TOO SOME YELLOW 400EX ONES, AND HE HAS AN EXTRA SET OF BLACK ONES THAT IM PUTTING ON MY GIRLS BIKE

[Dave400ex]

You can Mod that all Out. The Powdercoating will look Cool. 400MXer is doing his all Black with a Chrome SubFrame, Steering Stem, and Top A-Arms. He wants to get some Silver Plastic too. It`s going to be Sweet.

Originally posted by MOOCAZEN
THE COOL THING IS MY CHICK HAS A MINT STOCK 88 250R,

I'd just marry the 250R and be done with it...:D

[MOOCAZEN]

Rico and not only that, its cheaper to modify the cr@p out of it then what im going to spend just on the wedding:confused:

[Dave400ex]

It`s your Choice. LOL.

[MOOCAZEN]

WAIT TILL YOU GET OLDER AND WHEN IT COMES TO THESE THINGS, GIRLS TEND TO HAVE A LITTLE MORE SAY IN IT, THAN OTHER THINGS

[Foxrage]

Ya your 400 is going to be sweet moocazen just wish i could find the good deals like you. I want a girl that will let me spend money on my quad and ****. If not then i just might be single forever.

[MOOCAZEN]

I JUST GOT NEWS, IF ANYONE IS INTERESTED, A FRIEND IS SELLING A FULL ON ROLL DESIGN BIKE SETUP FOR DESERT AND CROSS COUNTRY, NATIONAL DUNCAN ENGINE, SWEET ***** BIKE, BLUE AND WHITE HE WANT 14000 FOR IT, ITS 6 MNTHS OLD, IF ANYONE OUT THERE IS INTERESTED, THE CHASIS PARTS ALONE COST 12000

Originally posted by NACS400EX
I want a girl that will let me spend money on my quad and ****. If not then i just might be single forever.


Looks like you and ole rosy are gonna be friends for a long time.:eek: ..women don't like you to spend money on anything but them..

[Foxrage]

Ya i know but i still will spend alot on my quad or ill be lonely i guess or maybe ill get lucky and find one like on huevos 4 o man that would be sweet.

[trx400ex]

warrior man.. i dont know if i am going or not, we are out in the garage all day long for the last few days trying to tune in the banshee...if we cant get it by tonight, we are calling trinity in the morning for a whole new single carb\ manifold kit, those dual carbs with the tors are a PITA.. we are going somewhere to ride this weekend, i just dont know where , i will let you know if we are going to the badlands

[killerkx327]

rolldesign and rollaxis you both have a very trick machines.i'm a tecate 4 guy and i'm jealous.i only wish i could get setups like those for my quad. lookin good.you should be proud.

[trx400ex]

well trinity wont get any carbs until friday, so i wont have it untill next week...if we can get the SOB running we will probably still go.....you need to see the jump i made... i made it like 2 feet tall , then a month later i go back and its 5 feet tall, its like the hill in huevos 3 where theres a jump at the bottom, only the hills smaller..later

how do you chrome a subframe on a bike when the sub frames solid to the frame

[NJ300ex]

you don't.

[RollAxis400ex]

you can send your frame to some companys and they will make your sub frame detachable

[Dave400ex]

Girls are a Great thing. We can`t Live without them, but we have to Spend Money on our Quads. I mean, come on. That`s why you need a Woman that has a Quad. Moocazen is Lucky.

TRX400EX, I hope you get it Running. We are all ready to go.

You could have somebody make a Removeable SubFrame. If not, I don`t see how you could Chrome the SubFrame. On a 400EX it is Easy.

[trx400ex]

ahah we got it tuned in last night, it isnt running perfect, but its good enough to ride for a weekend:D :D

[Dave400ex]

Well I should see you there. Are you taking the 400 too?

[Clay]

A girl that likes quads is a beautiful thing. My girlfriend before the one i have now freakin hated me racing and riding four wheelers because for some reason she felt that the quad was more important than her (and it was WAY more important to me, but anyway). The girl i have now loves riding my quad, and loves me racing and spending money on the quad, because its something I enjoy doing, and she just wants to see me happy. God I love her, LOL. My point is, the girls are out there that like this stuff, you just have to find em.

[Dave400ex]

I know there is Girls out there like that. I hope I can find one.

[trx400ex]

they will both be there, more than likely my dad will be riding the 400,, i just got back from a sweet ride, we built 6 huge double and a sweet stepup

[Foxrage]

So you got your 400 ready and up again what all did you change since the wreck? I woulnt mind having a banshee but i think ill keep mine.

[Dave400ex]

Well we will be there Saturday Morning around 10.

[trx400ex]

Originally posted by NACS400EX
So you got your 400 ready and up again what all did you change since the wreck? I woulnt mind having a banshee but i think ill keep mine. i didnt really change anythign big, i just got diffrent bumper, and little stuff like that, i still haev burgard aarms and pep shocks... the banshees my main focus now


Warriorman- we might be going to haspin now because my dad called them and they said the race is on sunday , so we can ride on there tracks saturday, i heard they rebuilt them, it is alot farther for us, but i really want to ride on a mx track

[Dave400ex]

Well that Sucks. You will have to let me know for Sure.

[James70214]

Moocazen
Why don't bpth of you keep your shocks and trade a arms. His shocks are going to need a rebuild soon probably, so you could keep your NEW shocks and get them revalved.

[Dave400ex]

I don`t think Moocazen`s Axis Fronts are New either. Plus he will want Triple Rates for the Roll Front. The Trade is Good.

[trx400ex]

well, i guess we might go to the badlands, i think it would be better since its closer, i will tell you for sure though....after going last week, we will get there at about 830, it was horrible, the driveway was packed, even after waiting a half hour to pay, we were trapped and had to wait more, get there as early as you can. there is a nice jump i cant wait to try next to the parking lot, you have to go up the hills and go back down them in 5 or 6th gear, it is kinda cool....well ill see ya there...maybe:confused:

[Dave400ex]

We will get there in between 9:30 and 10. By then there isn`t many People there. We Ride the Woods or Dunes most of the Time. I should see you.

[trx400ex]

yeah, i might have a hard time picking you out of the crowd, usually there is about 90 percent 400exs there...(i guess that tells you something :D) , we will be parked down by the grain bins

[James70214]

He said his axis wweree new, but I realized he doesnt have long travel shocks only a arms. My bad

[Dave400ex]

Well just Listen and Look for a TC Pipe. There is going to be 15 or more of us. There will be 2 Campers, a White Ford Dually, and all Three of them have Enclosed Trailers. We will be with them. We have a Black Truck and Trailer. Just look for one Nice Blue Nac`s 250r.

[trx400ex]

this thread is probably the longest ever..

[Dave400ex]

It might be. We have talked about many things in this Thread.

[Foxrage]

We have talked about alot of everything i think the lobo thing was off on like 1st or 2nd page.

[trx400ex]

what are your favorite radials?

[Dave400ex]

I don`t even remember. This is the 16th Page now. It has been a Good Thread. How many Days has this Thread been going On?

[trx400ex]

it was started on the 26

[Dave400ex]

It`s getting Close to a Week and a Half.

[trx400ex]

how often do you guys go riding, i go everyday, unless its rainging or really muddy out

[Dave400ex]

Really? I haven`t been Riding on Dirt since January. The last time was Haspin back in Jan. During the Summer we go every Weekend. There is no where to Ride by our House, so you have to go Places all the Time.

[trx400ex]

do you live out in the country? there are places to ride here, but i have to ride on the road to get there, and some of my friends live 15 miles away, so my tires go quick, i know if i had a track or woods in my backyard i would go more often

[Dave400ex]

Yeah we live in the Country, but there is no where to Ride. I hope to make some Trails at my Neighbors this Summer.

[trx400ex]

are you gonna bring your quad to the ironman this year

[Foxrage]

I ride everyday i want to ride i have like 93 acres no jumps that are awsome which sucks.

[Dave400ex]

I`m not Old enough to Race. You have to be 16. Plus I need to Race Local and see how it goes before I go to IronMan. That is like the Hardest Track on the GNCC Circuit. I need a lot of Mods before I do that. I want to go to the Race though.

93 Acres? That would be Nice.

[trx400ex]

nah, id do it on a bone stock wheela, i def. wouldnt win, but id be doin it for fun anyway, but i meant are you going to ride there, you know they let you take your quads and ride them around, even if you arent racing

[Dave400ex]

Really? We could just go up there and Ride around? Do they have a Open Practice there?

[Foxrage]

Im going to try to go to alot of races this season if i can not to race though i doubt ill go to any XC but alot of the MX ones around here.

[400MXer]

I just recieved my PEP ZPS shocks....they are SWEEEEEEET!!!!!
I can't wait to put them on and push my fourwheeler around...i'm still waiting for my motor. GRRRRRRRR


And the RTC lever is sweet....not quite at sturdy as i thought it would be, but nice. i'll start takin' pics and get them on here.

[Foxrage]

Sweet dude yoou gotta give us a review and some pics. Well when you get your motor.

[mrusk]

400MXer that is great that you got the shocks!! Once you ride it you will understand that they were worth the wait.

Colbly at CD told me last night elka shipped my shocks! So i should have the any day now!

matt

[honda400exrider]

what types of riding conditions do u guys ride in? i dont think im ready to get shocks yet though. a little out of my price range.:rolleyes:

[Dave400ex]

Well about time 400MXer. Now all you need is your Motor so you can go Riding. You will have to give us a Review on the Shocks so we know if they are Worth the Wait.

[400MXer]

oh....i will give a race tested review...because, if i get my motor in time, i'm racing the Pontiac Silver dome race next weekend. Should be fun....and if i don't get my motor....i guess i'm gonna be watching.

[Dave400ex]

Well I hope you get your Motor. You will have to make sure it`s Broke in before you go and Race though.

[400MXer]

i know...., but i might have to break it in at the race..jk