rebuilt engine, electrical problem

[Chanman420q]

i just finished putting my motor back together today and the thing wont start, when i hit the button, the silinoid just clicks. i checked the connection at the battery and the silionied and everything is tight..... i dunno what it could be. anyone have any ideas

i tried the screw driver thing on the silinoid to by pass it and still nothing, just a lot of sparks:o same clicking

[Chanman420q]

i just tried to bump start it and the tires wont move at all unless the clutch is pulled in or in neutral, doesnt watter what gear im in, ive tried 2nd and 5th. but if i push it backwards it will role back a little bit ( in gear ) then i can push it forward that same distance it went back.... i have a race tomarrow that i dont think im gunna be making now...

[ZSK]

Make sure your battery has a good charge. If it isn't fully charged you will get the clicking. Did you go higher compression? The stock battery might not have the amperage to crank the piston. For bump starting, I suggest you hook a rope up to another quad and dump the clutch in 2nd gear rolling about 15 MPH. Or use a large hill.

[Chanman420q]

yeah 11:1 weisco, and i charged the battery up for an hour and a half and the same thing happend. the wheels wont spin unless i push it backwards first so i dunno..... the starter like isnt engaging or something. Just this little click click click stuff. uhg looks as if i wont be racing tomarrow :(

[Chanman420q]

no one has any ideas? :(

[Flo Bee]

The issue is probably your battery... Charge it overnight on a low amperage setting. If it's still doing the same thing, jump it from a running car/truck and see if that gives you enough amps. If you're still having issues, start checkng things out.

[Spikers400]

i had the same problem. After hosing my quad off before the rebuild i figure water got onto the terminals and caused them to cerode. What i did was took off the cables from both the battery and celinoid. Sprayed terminal cleaner on them and scrubbed them with a wire brush. after that the clicking went away and it startes everytime now.

[Chanman420q]

Originally posted by Spikers400
i had the same problem. After hosing my quad off before the rebuild i figure water got onto the terminals and caused them to cerode. What i did was took off the cables from both the battery and celinoid. Sprayed terminal cleaner on them and scrubbed them with a wire brush. after that the clicking went away and it startes everytime now.

you think thats still the problem even after i tried by passing the problem with the screw driver

[haywire4130]

did you time the cam properly? does the engine spin over with a 17mm socket thru the hole in the stator cover? it sounds like it is jammed to me... have a local auto parts store do a load test on your battery to rule that out.

[Chanman420q]

Originally posted by haywire4130
did you time the cam properly? does the engine spin over with a 17mm socket thru the hole in the stator cover? it sounds like it is jammed to me... have a local auto parts store do a load test on your battery to rule that out.

the engine isnt cranking at all, the starter isnt even trying, the only noise i hear is click... click... click...

normally ud hear the starter going.... so i know its an electrical problem, its not that the engine is cranking and not starting. and yes the timing has been set correctly.

[250rmike]

try turning the motor over with a socket and no spark plug(so compression isnt a problem) if it wont turn over hen something is locked up if not get a meter and test the wires between the battery and starter solenoid etc. see whether the starter is even getting any juice

[Spikers400]

thats exactly what i had. If the terminals on the selinoid were all scummy connecting the two wouldnt do anythign if they arent the juice isnt making to the terminal. It takes 2 seconds to clean them. Just give it a try. I had the same deal.

[Chanman420q]

i cleaned the silinoid with degreaser and steel wool and still nothing, then i stuck the screw driver in there and hit the button ( after freaking out over the sparks flying ) and i got a tiny little jolt outa the starter but it only happend that once.

[250rmike]

sounds like the starter button might be messed up. also could be very dead battery. try charging the battery over night then see what happens if nothing then get out a volt meter and check the current going to the switch

[Chanman420q]

i got this thing at wal mart that when u push the button and wave it over something electricle, it will buzz/librate, it did it sometimes over the wires. ive gotten a little noise out of the starter 2 times so far, but not anything to get excited about. i dont think its the start button. because when i push it, the silinoid does click. so i dont know now, now im gunna miss another race. :(

i took the starter case off, and looked at it, the little gear at the top left spins when i spin it, should it not? i was in neutral

[DantheEXman]

Try putting the battery on a charger, at 12 amps. As its connected, Try to start it.

Or try jumper cables.

If its not electrical... Then take the timing hole off the side case, stick a 17 mm socket in the hole and turn it. It it wont turn, then its seized up and you will have bigger problems.

[DantheEXman]

Originally posted by Chanman420q
i just tried to bump start it and the tires wont move at all unless the clutch is pulled in or in neutral, doesnt watter what gear im in, ive tried 2nd and 5th. but if i push it backwards it will role back a little bit ( in gear ) then i can push it forward that same distance it went back.... i have a race tomarrow that i dont think im gunna be making now...

Maybe its just me that is reading that wrong...

But isn't it SUPPOSED to do that? I mean, its not going to move if its in gear. The only way the tired are going to move is if its in neutral, or the clutch is in, Just like you said.

I think your battery needs a good charge. Try jumping it. Or Like I said above with the charger connected. Kind of gives it a little boost.

[04'400ex'er]

Originally posted by DantheEXman
Maybe its just me that is reading that wrong...

But isn't it SUPPOSED to do that? I mean, its not going to move if its in gear. The only way the tired are going to move is if its in neutral, or the clutch is in, Just like you said.

I think your battery needs a good charge. Try jumping it. Or Like I said above with the charger connected. Kind of gives it a little boost. If you get the machine moving fast enough, the momentum will turn the engine over in return, causing it to start.next time you ride, assuming your ride has a clutch, cruise in 3rd or 4th, shut it off, and while rolling, drop the clutch. It will start the machine.

ChanMan, tie'er up to a car and try get the car to 15 or 20, and droper in 4th. If that don't start'er, your motor is siezed. Also if your tires just skid, it is siezed. If it starts, keep it running and if it was the battery, the longer it runs the more the batt. charges. If you try this, You will know if it is electrical or a siezed motor.

[BSTURDIVANT]

Take the mag side cover plug out and turn with 17mm socket before doing anything else!! Sounds like something binding in engine.
If it turns free then its probably electrical.
If it clicks the starter button and solenoid are ok- check battery voltage and wire to starter.

[Chanman420q]

i did a test on the battery and ive got 15volts, also the motor isnt seized, the piston has 0 seconds on it. it hasnt been started since i replaced the piston so its no that, and id try the 17mm socket idea but i dont have a allen key big enough for the hole on that side so i cant do that. thanx for all the help guys i really appreiate it, im just gunna have to take it to the dealer i guess, nothing i can do i tried my best. ive got the battery charging as we speak and im gunna let it go all night. im gunna get up at like 6 to see if works and if it does ill be puttin it back together for the race. just have to break the motor in at practice

[250rmike]

it could also be the starter

[Chanman420q]

Originally posted by 250rmike
it could also be the starter

i took the starter cover off and the gear at the top left spins when i spin it. is that bad or good?

[haywire4130]

if you don't have a hex key to remove the plug from the stator cover, how'd you rebuild the top end? this tells me that the cam isn't timed properly, and you smashed your nice new piston into the valves the first time you hit the button. forcing it by pulling it behind a car or boosting the battery to the moon is gonna make it worse. if something doesn't go, find out why. (don't hit it with a bigger hammer). i know you want it to be electrical, but it all adds up. please post a reply when the dealer gets it figured out, i'd like to know. also, a volt test doesn't tell you if a battery is good, you need to do a load test, which simulates the strain put on a battery when you try to start your quad. autozone has one of these testers and will check yours for free. while you're there, pick up one of those hex keys for future reference! good luck man

[Chanman420q]

no piston smashed anywhere, the starter hasnt cranked it up once

[DantheEXman]

Did you try pop starting it down a big hill? Or towed behind a car?

If it skids, its siezed up and you put something together wrong.

[Chanman420q]

Originally posted by DantheEXman
Did you try pop starting it down a big hill? Or towed behind a car?

If it skids, its siezed up and you put something together wrong.

ive tried pushing it, but i havent tried towing it or pushing it down a hill

[250rmike]

you shouldnt be able to push i thought u already tried to tow it. try towing it. but i would check the piston and make sure it is timed properly before you mess nething up

[Spikers400]

wow u are gunna have sum problems. You absalutely need to get the engine in exact tdc when installing the cam gear and chain. idk how u did it but i can asure u its not right unless it was at tdc and the marks lined up

[Chanman420q]

Originally posted by Spikers400
wow u are gunna have sum problems. You absalutely need to get the engine in exact tdc when installing the cam gear and chain. idk how u did it but i can asure u its not right unless it was at tdc and the marks lined up

before u get on my case, yes the cam is lined up and yes the piston was at TDC so um yea back off killer

[haywire4130]

easy does it man, we're trying to help not insult your mechanical ability. how did you det it to tdc without removing the stator cover plug and without using the starter (which you seem to think is bad)? just spin it over with the plug out and using a ratchet to verify that everything spins. if the motor is jammed, the starter will click (and the positive cable will get very hot) just like you described. if you won't buy the tool, take the spark plug out and put it in gear and try to push it, it should spin no problem. actually, it has a compression release, it should spin with the plug in. good luck

[Chanman420q]

the starter isnt clicking, the silinoid is the one clicking, ill go to the store and get the tool i need for that hole, what size do i need? the biggest one i have fits the footpegs, but i dont know what size that is

and if the piston was jammed would it just click? i would think that id be getting SOMETHING from the starter even if it was jammed

[Martin Blair]

If it fits the foot pegs it most likly fits the flywheel cover screw.

As you remeber I had the same problem and just claned everything adn scraped some of the old discoulered metal off all the conections, then used die electrical grease to keep them from corroding again.

Also you could try to start the bike buy jumping it straight from the bat to the starter, and buypassing all the electronics. Turn the ignition on and the starter is automaticaly gounded, if you have a good ground on the frame, just jump it straight from positive on the batt to the seloniod out that goes to the starter.

[Chanman420q]

Originally posted by HN400exracer
If it fits the foot pegs it most likly fits the flywheel cover screw.

As you remeber I had the same problem and just claned everything adn scraped some of the old discoulered metal off all the conections, then used die electrical grease to keep them from corroding again.

Also you could try to start the bike buy jumping it straight from the bat to the starter, and buypassing all the electronics. Turn the ignition on and the starter is automaticaly gounded, if you have a good ground on the frame, just jump it straight from positive on the batt to the seloniod out that goes to the starter.

not the same size, already tried it, also cleaned the silinoid, no go, and i stuck a screw driver between the silinoid, and it still clicked, an that does by pass the silinoid so i dont know wjat to do

[Doibugu2]

How did you time the engine if you didn't take that cover? Who did the rebuild work?

[Chanman420q]

me , my friend and his dad did the work, when we put the piston in, we brought it up to the top of the cylender, them i set the cam on the marks like it should be done. i dont know why u guys keep bringing the timing issue back up, its not that the motor is cranking and not starting, its that its not CRANKING period. So lets work out one bug before we get a head of our selves

[250rmike]

i think there playing off the fact that it wont start by jump starting or pulling behind anything.

[F-16Guy]

Originally posted by Chanman420q
me , my friend and his dad did the work, when we put the piston in, we brought it up to the top of the cylender, them i set the cam on the marks like it should be done. i dont know why u guys keep bringing the timing issue back up, its not that the motor is cranking and not starting, its that its not CRANKING period. So lets work out one bug before we get a head of our selves
I think what everyone is trying to get at is: Will the engine physically turn over or not. If there is something wrong internally that is causing the crank assembly to jam, then it doesn't matter how well your battery's charged, how good the connections are, etc., your starter will NOT turn the engine over. You need to determine this FIRST, before you start doing any 5th gear, 50 mph pull starts. I think the very first thing you need to do is remove the spark plug (to eliminate compression), remove the two plugs on the left side cover for the flywheel bolt and timing mark, and try to turn the engine over counter-clockwise by turning the flywheel bolt with a breaker bar and socket. With the bike in neutral or the back wheels off the ground, if the engine doesn't turn over one full revolution fairly easily, then you have a major problem inside the engine. Don't just assume that the engine is ruled out because you just rebuilt it. In my mind, that makes it the prime suspect. Who knows, maybe someone accidentally dropped something in the case while you weren't looking. BTW, the big plug takes a 10mm allen wrench.

[Chanman420q]

ok well heres the deal, the piston did turn over, but i only removed the center one ( the 10mm, just went to sears and bought one ) it didnt turn over going counter clockwise unless i went clockwise first, but yeah it did turn over, easily after that. also, a friend of mine gave me the idea to take my battery charger and hook the possitive side to the nut where the power goes to get to the start and to ground the other side. said that when i plug it in it should give the sharter juice to go, well that didnt work. so i think my starters dead

[F-16Guy]

Originally posted by Chanman420q
...so i think my starters dead
That's very possible. Try tapping the solenoid a few times and see if that helps. Mine went bad and would usually work the first time I hit the button, but if my bike didn't start, I'd have to tap on it to get it to work a second time. As much as that damn solenoid cost, you'd better hope it's not the starter!:devil:

[Chanman420q]

Originally posted by F-16Guy
That's very possible. Try tapping the solenoid a few times and see if that helps. Mine went bad and would usually work the first time I hit the button, but if my bike didn't start, I'd have to tap on it to get it to work a second time. As much as that damn solenoid cost, you'd better hope it's not the starter!:devil:

i tried that, my dad gave me the idea cuz he used to have to beat the silinoid in his old Chevy half ton


i just checked the price of the starter and yea i dont want it to be that. 200 bucks! Fuqqq thattt

also note i said that it didnt wanna go counter clock wise til i went CLOCK wise first, but then it would spin back with out much trouble.... is this right?

[250rmike]

try towing it behind something and pop starting it. thats the only way to see if it will start. if the starter was good before but not now you could have shorted it

[Chanman420q]

Originally posted by 250rmike
try towing it behind something and pop starting it. thats the only way to see if it will start. if the starter was good before but not now you could have shorted it

what would need replacing? the whole thing? or just a certain part

[F-16Guy]

Originally posted by Chanman420q
what would need replacing? the whole thing? or just a certain part
You should be able to determine if the starter itself is bad by disconnecting it from the solenoid and applying 12 volts directly to it. If it turns over, then you have a problem somewhere else. There have been people (including a friend of mine) that have had harness problems, probably from getting smashed from a wreck. Try the starter independantly first.

[Chanman420q]

Originally posted by F-16Guy
Try the starter independantly first.

i did, read the posts above